Don't Look Now but Joseph Might be a Better a Catcher for the Orioles...

[Brendan25]

Thanks COC!

[gmelson26]

Probably should be merged, but I 'might' agree. TB wins year in and year out by making hard decisions like this. If nothing else, the team has proven they can win with him behind the plate regardless of where you think his true talent level lays. I was never a catcher.. outfielder and 1B, but from what I've seen I think he does just as well if not better at certain aspects of it. Some will argue SSS, but when it comes to defense, I don't think SSS matters all the same.

On a side note, I think people hide behind SSS so they can sit on fences. We're not scouts, but we can make educated guesses without years of statical data. A few years from now, we can look back at things and have a different debate.

[Can_of_corn]

Probably should be merged, but I 'might' agree. TB wins year in and year out by making hard decisions like this. If nothing else, the team has proven they can win with him behind the plate regardless of where you think his true talent level lays. I was never a catcher.. outfielder and 1B, but from what I've seen I think he does just as well if not better at certain aspects of it. Some will argue SSS, but when it comes to defense, I don't think SSS matters all the same.

On a side note, I think people hide behind SSS so they can sit on fences. We're not scouts, but we can make educated guesses without years of statical data. A few years from now, we can look back at things and have a different debate.

The SSS concerns me, but the fact that he wasn't nearly this good a player in the minors, where he played a LONG time, has me a lot more concerned.

[gmelson26]

The SSS concerns me, but the fact that he wasn't nearly this good a player in the minors, where he played a LONG time, has me a lot more concerned.

Yeah his reputation in the minors interests me.. makes me wonder if what I'm seeing is legit. Though, I cannot see how the stroke of midnight will magically turn him into a pumpkin out in the field. I get someone going on a lucky/torrid streak (see Davis' first half '13).

[calmunderfire]

Joseph may be a better catcher than Wieters. When you consider his team contract status and mileage he may be the answer long term.

But Wieters is Buck's guy. We have seen that Buck rides and dies with his guy's. He's a loyalty manager and Joseph isn't his guy at the catcher position.

[weams]

Boom! You can't stop Caleb Joseph. You can only hope to contain him.

Four consecutive starts.

[mdbdotcom]

I hope he doesn't get snared in the Biogenesis net.

[Can_of_corn]

I hope he doesn't get snared in the Biogenesis net.

I don't think he had the spare money lying around to cheat.

[SteveO]

I kinda feel like its a theoretical exercise more than one based in reality. What I mean is that MW will be back next year, its unlikely he is traded as coming off TJ surgery his value will certainly be diminished on the trade market. If he comes back then he is the starter next year. CJ has proven he could be a guy to watch and has the potential to hold down the position in the future but thinking he is better than a healthy MW is a stretch IMO.

Out of curiosity what are the rules regarding an injured player and arbitration? Can the O's not tender him or are they obligated regardless to pay him? If the option of not tendering him exists could they use that in an effort to get him to sign a two or three year deal at a reasonable rate? I doubt Matt would want to hit the market coming off of TJ surgery maybe you could get him/Boras to sign off on a two year deal to establish maximum value again.

[Il BuonO]

I kinda feel like its a theoretical exercise more than one based in reality. What I mean is that MW will be back next year, its unlikely he is traded as coming off TJ surgery his value will certainly be diminished on the trade market. If he comes back then he is the starter next year. CJ has proven he could be a guy to watch and has the potential to hold down the position in the future but thinking he is better than a healthy MW is a stretch IMO.

Out of curiosity what are the rules regarding an injured player and arbitration? Can the O's not tender him or are they obligated regardless to pay him? If the option of not tendering him exists could they use that in an effort to get him to sign a two or three year deal at a reasonable rate? I doubt Matt would want to hit the market coming off of TJ surgery maybe you could get him/Boras to sign off on a two year deal to establish maximum value again.

A two year deal to establish value seems reasonable. Otoh, I'm not sure the word reasonable and Boras have ever been used in the same sentence before.

[PA724_Oriole]

I think his stock would be higher come deadline time next year. But they weren't be doing there job if they didn't explore the possibilities.

[El Gordo]

I doubt that Wieters, not having demonstrated his health by this winter, and costing 8 M in arb, would bring back more than the QO pick we would get when he goes FA.

[Richmond Bird 9]

I think Matt D/H's 60/70% of the time and playing 1b/c once every 10 days to start the season, than start to catch more as the season goes. His main trade value this winter is not we can get for him, however the money we can save if traded.

[El Gordo]

If Wieters shows he's healthy next spring, his value would be just about what it was to start this season, with one less year to FA, of course. Probably wouldn't get a lot for him and the O's are most likely to go with a Wieters/Joseph combo next year. They might be a lot more at ease going into Wieter's walk year though.

But the OP's point was to trade Wieters this winter which would be pointless IMO.

[Il BuonO]

The SSS concerns me, but the fact that he wasn't nearly this good a player in the minors, where he played a LONG time, has me a lot more concerned.

I can't find the link, but it's also been discussed by Bordick during the MASN broadcasts that he spent extra time with Don Werner and John Russell last year and was told specifically by Brian Graham that if his POP times and defense in general didn't improve he wouldn't move up.

They noticed the work he put in.