TT: Scott used increased spin rate to dominate last year

[Tony-OH]

https://www.orioleshangout.com/2021/02/25/tanner-scott-used-increased-spin-rates-to-dominate-last-year/

[Moose Milligan]

Here's hoping that this is the start of the organization being able to tease better spin rates out of pitchers and getting better performances.  

Small sample size for 2020 for Tanner Scott but at least it's a trend in the right direction.  

[Can_of_corn]

6 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Here's hoping that this is the start of the organization being able to tease better spin rates out of pitchers and getting better performances.  

Small sample size for 2020 for Tanner Scott but at least it's a trend in the right direction.  

Sure glad they just didn't give up on him after his early struggles.  Boy that would have been stupid.

[Oriole1940]

Yes, as I said some time back, I have seen untold numbers of wild lefties come up over the years and some never gain enough control to know where the ball is going after it leaves their hand.  Then some gain just enough control to be effectively wild, so the batter does not dig in on them.    Glad Scott was given enough innings to show what he could do in that regard.  

[Frobby]

On an individual level, I enjoy reading about pitchers who have used the advanced technology and analytics to improve their pitches.   On a macro level, I worry that the technology and analytics are more helpful to pitchers than hitters, and are going to lead to even more strikeouts than we already have in the game.   

[survivedc]

29 minutes ago, Frobby said:

On an individual level, I enjoy reading about pitchers who have used the advanced technology and analytics to improve their pitches.   On a macro level, I worry that the technology and analytics are more helpful to pitchers than hitters, and are going to lead to even more strikeouts than we already have in the game.   

It doesn’t make sense to me because you would think that as pitchers increase spin rate batters swing for the fences less, but it hasn’t played out that way so far.

Separately, and this has probably been covered somewhere at some point, but how does one “increase spin rate?” Is it as simple as more whip/snap on the release?

[interloper]

On the one hand, we're still talking about 20 IP out of his career 102 in the bigs.

On the other hand, this is great news that methods employed by the new brain trust can indeed produce real results.

[Tony-OH]

1 hour ago, interloper said:

On the one hand, we're still talking about 20 IP out of his career 102 in the bigs.

On the other hand, this is great news that methods employed by the new brain trust can indeed produce real results.

But that's why the increase of spin rate is so important. When you talk stats from last year people can bring up SSS, but spin rates don't really change all that much from pitch to pitch. When the average jumps up up so much and then you combine that with the better stats, I think it means something more than just a good year alone stats wise over 20 innings pitched.

[Sports Guy]

One of the more exciting parts of the team is the bullpen and the upside of some of the arms out there.  The Scott/Harvey combo is at the top of that list.

Those 2 staying healthy and being consistent are huge for the long term.  They have a chance to be a dominant back end of the pen.  Bullpens are finally starting to be valued more in line with how important they are but I still think we underestimate the importance of a great pen, largely because WAR does a poor job of evaluating relievers imo.

[Frobby]

53 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Bullpens are finally starting to be valued more in line with how important they are but I still think we underestimate the importance of a great pen, largely because WAR does a poor job of evaluating relievers imo.

I can’t see how any Orioles fan could underestimate the importance of a great bullpen.   When you look at our 2012-16 teams, the bullpen was an absolutely key component of those teams, especially in 2012 and 2016 when we certainly would not have made the playoffs but for the outstanding bullpen performance.    Even in 2014, the bullpen was a key feature and we got beat in the playoffs because KC’s bullpen was even better than ours.   

You know who doesn’t underestimate the importance of a great bullpen?   The Yankees.    
 

[Can_of_corn]

28 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I can’t see how any Orioles fan could underestimate the importance of a great bullpen.   When you look at our 2012-16 teams, the bullpen was an absolutely key component of those teams, especially in 2012 and 2016 when we certainly would not have made the playoffs but for the outstanding bullpen performance.    Even in 2014, the bullpen was a key feature and we got beat in the playoffs because KC’s bullpen was even better than ours.   

You know who doesn’t underestimate the importance of a great bullpen?   The Yankees.    
 

Drungo talks about bullpens of today filled with anonymous arms throwing 98 but to me the heyday was right around 2014.  It looked for a bit there that baseball was going to turn into a game that if you had the lead after six, you won.  Some very nasty bullpens.

[Moose Milligan]

16 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Drungo talks about bullpens of today filled with anonymous arms throwing 98 but to me the heyday was right around 2014.  It looked for a bit there that baseball was going to turn into a game that if you had the lead after six, you won.  Some very nasty bullpens.

I remember going to an ALCS game 2 at at OPACY against the Royals in 2014 and thinking...**** we aren't going to score here after the 6th inning.  

I don't want to speak for @DrungoHazewood when he says anonymous arms throwing 98, but to me that statement means that there are a bunch of guys that throw 98 now.  30 years ago, it wasn't common and you definitely knew all the guys that could hit 98+...anyone hitting 100, it was an event, it was on SportsCenter. 

Now it's like any team can bring in a guy that can hit triple digits, it's not rare like it used to be.  IMO, that's how I read into that statement.  It doesn't mean that those guys throwing 98+ are any good, though.  Just means there are a lot of guys right now that can do it.

[Frobby]

41 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

I don't want to speak for @DrungoHazewood Now it's like any team can bring in a guy that can hit triple digits, it's not rare like it used to be.  IMO, that's how I read into that statement.  It doesn't mean that those guys throwing 98+ are any good, though.  Just means there are a lot of guys right now that can do it.

It seems like there are an increasing number of guys who throw really hard and know what they’re doing.    In 2014 there were 24 relievers who averaged 96+ on their fastball.    Last year it was 34.    Not all of them are actually good, but more of them are these days.   
 

[Just Regular]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

You know who doesn’t underestimate the importance of a great bullpen?   The Yankees.    

I enjoy the notion Buck's Orioles taught the Yankees a little something on roster configuration - the 2012 Yankees gave 190/170/110 innings to Phil Hughes, Ivan Nova and Freddy Garcia at the back of their rotation, and only Soriano/Robertson felt like pen standouts.  Buck had 7 relievers with sub-3.00 ERA's, Tommy Hunter 2nd on the team in innings, and almost beat them in Why Not, Episode 2  (Episode 3 scheduled for 2022 release)

Behind whatever 2 frontline starters we can glean from Means/Baumann/Hall/Rodriguez/2021 pick 1-5/$$$$, I am mostly agnostic on the roles Tier 1 non-aces, Kremer, Akin, etc. eventually fall into.   There will be data on pitch-to-pitch effectiveness, recovery to baseline performance.  Mike Minor will rant but I don't think TTOP avoidance is slowing unless rosters get re-worked to stop pitcher carousels in the new CBA. 

I am rooting Cesar Valdez to pitch to Batters 19-27 the 1st game of every series for 2 series/week times 26 weeks, and see what kind of 100 IP outcome results (this can be more fun if DL Hall does it in 2023, if he isn't an ace).    Hopefully talented pitchers can look at Trevor May and Jake Odorizzi today (or Drew Pomeranz last year), and not get too freaked out about this earning potential-wise.

 

[DrungoHazewood]

3 hours ago, Moose Milligan said:

I remember going to an ALCS game 2 at at OPACY against the Royals in 2014 and thinking...**** we aren't going to score here after the 6th inning.  

I don't want to speak for @DrungoHazewood when he says anonymous arms throwing 98, but to me that statement means that there are a bunch of guys that throw 98 now.  30 years ago, it wasn't common and you definitely knew all the guys that could hit 98+...anyone hitting 100, it was an event, it was on SportsCenter. 

Now it's like any team can bring in a guy that can hit triple digits, it's not rare like it used to be.  IMO, that's how I read into that statement.  It doesn't mean that those guys throwing 98+ are any good, though.  Just means there are a lot of guys right now that can do it.

Yes, that's the gist of it.  The Orioles have been a poor team recently, with pitchers seemingly found under rocks and hitchhiking on I-695, and even they have half the bullpen that can throw 95+.  In 1990 if you had one guy who could throw 97 he'd be a demigod.

Remember Colt Griffin?  The Royals took him #9 overall in 2001, mainly on the strength of him hitting 100 mph once on a radar gun in a workout after his senior year in high school.  His arm disintegrated about 25 minutes later, and I don't think he even really knew how to pitch.  But today... would it even be a big deal if a kid once hit 100?  Every single team has some guys who've done that, and many of them on a regular basis.  In my lifetime an average fastball has to be up six mph or more.