Toronto without the HGH

[Crazysilver03]

It can be tested for. With a blood test. If you are questioned, then you should step up and take a test. This thread started with the OP suggesting that maybe their were PED's being used up there. He was chastised for it and wrongfully so.

Not wrongfully. There is no factual evidence to make that claim.

[Oriolidae85]

Instead of spouting off about things that you are mostly ill informed about, why not do a little reading and find out just what PED's do and don't do.

I believe you have posted a number of these links before and I read a bunch of them and cannot believe in a theory that suggests that PED's had no impact on improving players production. For one, the theory (at least from the articles I read) seems to ignore that pitchers were not also using PED to somewhat counter balance the effect of increased offensive production. Two: MarkM, Bonds and Sosa....especially Bonds late surge in power, these facts cannot be ignored.

[JERSEYORIOLE]

Not wrongfully. There is no factual evidence to make that claim.

It was wrong to chastise him. Considering the history, he had every right to question it and maybe even ASSUME it to be true.

[JERSEYORIOLE]

I believe you have posted a number of these links before and I read a bunch of them and cannot believe in a theory that suggests that PED's had no impact on improving players production. For one, the theory (at least from the articles I read) seems to ignore that pitchers were not also using PED to somewhat counter balance the effect of increased offensive production. Two: MarkM, Bonds and Sosa....especially Bonds late surge in power, these facts cannot be ignored.

More to the point. If they didnt help, why would people be taking them? More to the point, why deny they took them when there was no rule against taking in baseball them until a couple years ago? Why didnt these players just go to doctors and get scribes for them? The argument is idiotic.

[crissfan172]

It can be tested for. With a blood test. If you are questioned, then you should step up and take a test. This thread started with the OP suggesting that maybe their were PED's being used up there. He was chastised for it and wrongfully so.

No...1,000,000 times no. You should never be forced to prove your innocence. Not in America.

[DrungoHazewood]

More to the point. If they didnt help, why would people be taking them? More to the point, why deny they took them when there was no rule against taking in baseball them until a couple years ago? Why didnt these players just go to doctors and get scribes for them? The argument is idiotic.

If that's a legitimate argument, then explain greenies. Whenever I bring up the point that thousands of MLB players (including Hank Aaron and Willie Mays) from the 1940s or 50s through today have used amphetamines, I'm told it's ok because they really don't do anything. It's almost the same as downing three or four cups of coffee, so it's not really a real PED, guys just took it for the placebo effect, or to be cool, or whatever.

So if greenies aren't doing anything, why did almost everyone for 40 or 50 years take them?

[SrMeowMeow]

It can be tested for. With a blood test. If you are questioned, then you should step up and take a test. This thread started with the OP suggesting that maybe their were PED's being used up there. He was chastised for it and wrongfully so.

I suspect you of rampant heroin abuse and of killing prostitutes over the course of the last three years. Please submit to a full battery of drug tests and disclose a complete log of your whereabouts for 2008-2010. Step up. Take a test.

Does that seem fair? It's not. It's exactly why innocent until proven guilty is the core of our judicial system, and it's why the OP was out of line.

[DrungoHazewood]

No...1,000,000 times no. You should never be forced to prove your innocence. Not in America.

Oh come on, when someone suggests the JERSEYORIOLE is clearly taking Xanax and Ritalin and greenies and a strange green powder that fell from space in an asteroid to keep up his outstanding posting on the Hangout, I'm sure he'll be more than willing to pay his own money and take time off work to subject himself to whatever invasive, expensive tests are necessary to prove his innocence.

[JERSEYORIOLE]

If that's a legitimate argument, then explain greenies. Whenever I bring up the point that thousands of MLB players (including Hank Aaron and Willie Mays) from the 1940s or 50s through today have used amphetamines, I'm told it's ok because they really don't do anything. It's almost the same as downing three or four cups of coffee, so it's not really a real PED, guys just took it for the placebo effect, or to be cool, or whatever.

So if greenies aren't doing anything, why did almost everyone for 40 or 50 years take them?

Good point. I think its slightly different. I dont think they actually build muscle mass. As a recovery drug they probably did work. But did they make you hit a ball further? I doubt it. But im no doctor.

[JERSEYORIOLE]

Oh come on, when someone suggests the JERSEYORIOLE is clearly taking Xanax and Ritalin and greenies and a strange green powder that fell from space in an asteroid to keep up his outstanding posting on the Hangout, I'm sure he'll be more than willing to pay his own money and take time off work to subject himself to whatever invasive, expensive tests are necessary to prove his innocence.

Thats hilarious. And stupid. If my career or reputation were on the line. Id take any test they put in front of me. Like a player would have to pay for a test. :scratchchinhmm:

[JERSEYORIOLE]

I suspect you of rampant heroin abuse and of killing prostitutes over the course of the last three years. Please submit to a full battery of drug tests and disclose a complete log of your whereabouts for 2008-2010. Step up. Take a test.

Does that seem fair? It's not. It's exactly why innocent until proven guilty is the core of our judicial system, and it's why the OP was out of line.

You can't be serious. So you are driving to work, and pass a guy with blook all over his hands and shirt, you then pass someone laying on the ground with a knife in him. Are you that Johnny Cochren, that its wrong to make an assumption that maybe the guy did it? The OP had every right to make that leap. I'm sure you were one of those guys cheering Barry Bonds was getting better at an age when the best players of all time were barely hanging on at the same age. Here is the sand, please insert head.

[Lateralus]

Right or wrong they are not legal. It puts people on uneven playing fields. Exactly what do you not understand about that?

If steroids are so wonderful and give that uneven playing field how come the O's on a whole haven't been able to win or in the case of individual O's players, have many players either hit boat loads of homerruns or pitch lights out. Since you know, the O's have had their fair share of 'roid users?

[DrungoHazewood]

Thats hilarious. And stupid. If my career or reputation were on the line. Id take any test they put in front of me. Like a player would have to pay for a test. :scratchchinhmm:

So you'd volunteer to subject yourself to any test just to keep anonymous posters on messageboards from thinking that your career year was due to some drug? As far as I know, no Blue Jays' career is on the line as they've all passed all of their required drug tests. It's all about reputation.

There's no way I'd do it. Especially since a negative HGH test would just make the "everyone is guilty" crowd move on to something else like undetectable designer steroids, or conspiracy theories. When you've convicted someone without evidence, is some evidence really going to change anything?

[Lateralus]

So you'd volunteer to subject yourself to any test just to keep anonymous posters on messageboards from thinking that your career year was due to some drug? As far as I know, no Blue Jays' career is on the line as they've all passed all of their required drug tests. It's all about reputation.

There's no way I'd do it. Especially since a negative HGH test would just make the "everyone is guilty" crowd move on to something else like undetectable designer steroids, or conspiracy theories. When you've convicted someone without evidence, is some evidence really going to change anything?

Yeah you gotta love the soapbox posters whose baseball careers peeked at the age of 7 in tee-ball.

99% of the time you put these soapboxers in the players shoes and they make the exact same decisions. Book it.

[JERSEYORIOLE]

So you'd volunteer to subject yourself to any test just to keep anonymous posters on messageboards from thinking that your career year was due to some drug? As far as I know, no Blue Jays' career is on the line as they've all passed all of their required drug tests. It's all about reputation.

There's no way I'd do it. Especially since a negative HGH test would just make the "everyone is guilty" crowd move on to something else like undetectable designer steroids, or conspiracy theories. When you've convicted someone without evidence, is some evidence really going to change anything?

No, Id do it to show I was clean and I respected the game. id have nothing to hide.