The Official JJ Hardy PA update thread

[LA2]

3 hours ago, Frobby said:

Did you miss what this team did in 1998-2000?    It appears we will be in the exact spot in July 2017 that we were in July 1998.     If so, I hope our front office won't make the same mistake it did then.

There are several ways to compare 1998 and 2017. How would you characterize the potential parallels?

[sportsfan8703]

We finally give Hardy a break and then that bunt situation happened yesterday.   If Hardy is in there everyone probably clearly knows there assignment.  

As much as Hardy is struggling and we can't let him get to the PA's, we probably need him at SS to prevent this season from getting embarrassing.  Manny just doesn't seem there mentally this year.  

[Frobby]

2 hours ago, LA2 said:

There are several ways to compare 1998 and 2017. How would you characterize the potential parallels?

A team that has many key players now past their prime, that is showing signs of no longer being able to compete.   In 1998 it took the front office two years to decide to bite the bullet and rebuild, finally selling some pieces in July 2000 at a small fraction of what they could have been worth a year or two earlier.      If this team doesn't turn things around in the next 4-5 weeks they'll be in the same position.

   

[SeaBird]

1 hour ago, sportsfan8703 said:

We finally give Hardy a break and then that bunt situation happened yesterday.   If Hardy is in there everyone probably clearly knows there assignment.  

As much as Hardy is struggling and we can't let him get to the PA's, we probably need him at SS to prevent this season from getting embarrassing.  Manny just doesn't seem there mentally this year.  

With regards to Manny, when even the team radio analyst, Bordick, is saying he'd be okay moving Machado I'm sure Machado has being traded in the back of his mind.

[webbrick2010]

1 hour ago, sportsfan8703 said:

We finally give Hardy a break and then that bunt situation happened yesterday.   If Hardy is in there everyone probably clearly knows there assignment.  

As much as Hardy is struggling and we can't let him get to the PA's, we probably need him at SS to prevent this season from getting embarrassing.  Manny just doesn't seem there mentally this year.  

We need a lot more than JJ Hardy at SS to stop being an embarrassment. JJ Hardy collecting a ML salary is embarrassing.

[ChuckS]

35 minutes ago, Frobby said:

A team that has many key players now past their prime, that is showing signs of no longer being able to compete.   In 1998 it took the front office two years to decide to bite the bullet and rebuild, finally selling some pieces in July 2000 at a small fraction of what they could have been worth a year or two earlier.      If this team doesn't turn things around in the next 4-5 weeks they'll be in the same position.

   

Coming off a wire to wire division win in 97 it may have made sense to go for it another year after 98 and hope for some bounce back.  But I agree we should have been sellers in 99. We waited a year too long IMO.  Even in 2000 we had some valuable pieces and got little in return due to having one of the most out of touch GM's in baseball at the time (Good Ol' Syd Thrift). 

With all the data/info out there now it would seem to me to be an even poorer mistake to try to hold onto this group while the trade value of our key players diminishes.  With almost any other team, I could say we would certainly be sellers at the deadline if things don't change drastically. The only thing that gives me pause is Duquette's and Buck's contract situation.  It's an ethical question with Duquette and with Buck it's more......does he have the stomach for a complete rebuild with a year left on his contract?

 

[Uli2001]

43 minutes ago, SeaBird said:

With regards to Manny, when even the team radio analyst, Bordick, is saying he'd be okay moving Machado I'm sure Machado has being traded in the back of his mind.

I don't buy that. But if it's true, then he is a headcase and really needs to be gone.

[sportsfan8703]

Manny's had a terrible season.  He's trying to be big time.  Well Harper and Trout never had .708 OPS seasons.  Put Machado on a vet team where he will be held accountable and he would be the old Manny.  

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Manny's had a terrible season.  He's trying to be big time.  Well Harper and Trout never had .708 OPS seasons.  Put Machado on a vet team where he will be held accountable and he would be the old Manny.  

Would you rather have a 708 3B/SS or a 768 Left fielder?

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Manny's had a terrible season.  He's trying to be big time.  Well Harper and Trout never had .708 OPS seasons.  Put Machado on a vet team where he will be held accountable and he would be the old Manny.  

Such a ludicrous comment.   Do you think he's trying to put up a .708 OPS?     Underperforming this year will cost him several million dollars next year, so you can bet he's plenty motivated to hit better.     But sometimes players struggle.   

Moreover, everyone in MLB understands that Trout is on a different level than Manny, even when Manny's at his best.     Harper's had his own ups and downs, and is certainly capable of outhitting Manny by a wide margin when he's right, but hasn't been consistently better than Manny as an overall player.    This year he's been much better so far; last year, Manny was better.    

Harper, by the way, has a .694 OPS over his last 24 games.    

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Frobby said:

Such a ludicrous comment.   Do you think he's trying to put up a .708 OPS?     Underperforming this year will cost him several million dollars next year, so you can bet he's plenty motivated to hit better.     But sometimes players struggle.   

Moreover, everyone in MLB understands that Trout is on a different level than Manny, even when Manny's at his best.     Harper's had his own ups and downs, and is certainly capable of outhitting Manny by a wide margin when he's right, but hasn't been consistently better than Manny as an overall player.    This year he's been much better so far; last year, Manny was better.    

Harper, by the way, has a .694 OPS over his last 24 games.    

I'm curious about what teams have more veteran leadership than the O's.  Who exactly is going to hold Manny accountable?  Papelbon?

[Cumberbundy]

On June 7, 2017 at 10:54 AM, Aristotelian said:

If we don't bring back JJ, the question is how do we replace him. From what I have seen, Manny is a much better 3B than SS. Even if Manny slides over, we have nobody to play 3B. I kind of like the idea to keep him to 598 ABs this year, pay the $2M, then bring him back on a cheap 1 year deal. But it is quite possible that Buck will do JJ a solid and make sure the option vests.

Jj hardy could be replaced by any of 45 people. It would be very disheartening to go into next year with him on the roster. He wouldn't have 5HRs if he was allowed to bat from second base. 

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, Cumberbundy said:

Jj hardy could be replaced by any of 45 people. It would be very disheartening to go into next year with him on the roster. He wouldn't have 5HRs if he was allowed to bat from second base. 

Of course not, the pitcher would still be throwing off the mound and he'd be hitting balls toward home plate. 

[TradeAngelos]

9 hours ago, Frobby said:

Back on point: Hardy is averaging 3.864 PA per start.    At that rate, if he started every game for the rest of the season, he'd end up with 604 PA.    He's already been benched in 6 of 65 games, so there's no reason at all to think Buck's not going to sit him several more times.     So we really don't need to worry at all about the 600 PA.    It's not going to happen, nor will it be particularly close.     

Wait wasn't he hurt for 3-4 of those games? There is no way he has been a healthy scratch 6 times.

[PaulFolk]

5 minutes ago, TradeAngelos said:

Wait wasn't he hurt for 3-4 of those games? There is no way he has been a healthy scratch 6 times.

He hasn't missed two consecutive games at any point, so no, I don't think those were injury-related. Buck's just giving him more frequent days off, as he should.