Matt Harvey close to minor league deal. (Update: signed)

[Moose Milligan]

7 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I know you are a fan, we've discussed it.

Did you know that the News, before they were the News, were the backing band on Elvis Costello's first album?

I did know that.  Great musicians. 

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

I did know that.  Great musicians. 

Yep, not a good fit for Elvis tho. 

[Tony-OH]

Considering Cueto was available for a minor league deal worth $4.2 million, you do have to question why he wasn't signed to that deal. He was better than Lyles in 2021 and he cost less. Would i rather have Lyles than Harvey, absolutely. 

But, that's the past, and we need to focus on what helps us this year. While Harvey would not have been first, second or probably 3rd choice, he might end up the best choice available at some point. 

i will say Zimmermann outpitched him at a higher level last night so if Zim can find his command again, I'd prefer to see him than Harvey.

[interloper]

12 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Considering Cueto was available for a minor league deal worth $4.2 million, you do have to question why he wasn't signed to that deal. He was better than Lyles in 2021 and he cost less. Would i rather have Lyles than Harvey, absolutely. 

But, that's the past, and we need to focus on what helps us this year. While Harvey would not have been first, second or probably 3rd choice, he might end up the best choice available at some point. 

i will say Zimmermann outpitched him at a higher level last night so if Zim can find his command again, I'd prefer to see him than Harvey.

I still have some hope for a Zimm rebound. To me it just looked like suddenly that awesome change up stopped being awesome. Lost a lot of movement on that and then lost ability to put the fastball on the corners. No reason to think he can't find his feel again. Sending him down was the right call because it looked like he was starting to get really frustrated about all the home runs. 

[Roll Tide]

I don’t get the Elias love affair with Harvey. He’s washed up to say the very least and was involved in drugs that killed a teammate 

[Moose Milligan]

24 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Considering Cueto was available for a minor league deal worth $4.2 million, you do have to question why he wasn't signed to that deal. He was better than Lyles in 2021 and he cost less. Would i rather have Lyles than Harvey, absolutely. 

But, that's the past, and we need to focus on what helps us this year. While Harvey would not have been first, second or probably 3rd choice, he might end up the best choice available at some point. 

i will say Zimmermann outpitched him at a higher level last night so if Zim can find his command again, I'd prefer to see him than Harvey.

Good points, and I agree.  Harvey might be the best option at some point here, I don't dispute that.  However, I don't believe he should have been here in the first place.

6 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

I don’t get the Elias love affair with Harvey. He’s washed up to say the very least and was involved in drugs that killed a teammate 

I'm being as fair as I can here, apparently he was a great teammate last year and the younger guys on the staff liked him and thought he helped out.  

[Pickles]

7 hours ago, Moose Milligan said:

First of all, there's no hill and I'm not dying.  

Second, yeah, it was a stupid move.  He's just not a good pitcher.  He's serviceable but you can find a lot of guys that can replace that production without the drama of what just happened to him.  I mean, Cueto would have been a much better option if Elias felt the need to bring in a veteran guy on a minor league deal who might have some gas in the tank and could be called upon in an emergency.  If you disagree with that, well, I can't help you.

I agree with @jamalshwand @Tony-OH, it sucks that some of the guys we were counting on have been injured or crapped the bed and yeah, there might be a need for Harvey in the very near future.  I don't deny that and understand the need for a guy like Harvey.

A guy like Harvey being the key part of the sentence there.  I'd have much preferred Cueto because 1.  He's a better pitcher.  2.  He doesn't have a known history of cocaine use.  3.  He hasn't recently served a suspension for distributing oxycodone.

I'll be the first guy to admit that I don't need to have saints playing for my baseball team.  But the talent has to outweigh any headaches, drama, suspensions, dirty laundry, etc.

You know, I guess it's just semantics, but I just don't get it.

"Not good" doesn't equal "serviceable."

"There might be a need for in the very near future" and you "understand the need for a guy like Harvey" doesn't equal "stupid move."

I'm sorry, but it just doesn't.

Despite your protestations, your only true objection seems to be the drug thing, as it's your only reference.

Again, nothing bores me more than that discussion so we can just drop it.

[Moose Milligan]

8 minutes ago, Pickles said:

You know, I guess it's just semantics, but I just don't get it.

"Not good" doesn't equal "serviceable."

"There might be a need for in the very near future" and you "understand the need for a guy like Harvey" doesn't equal "stupid move."

I'm sorry, but it just doesn't.

Despite your protestations, your only true objection seems to be the drug thing, as it's your only reference.

Again, nothing bores me more than that discussion so we can just drop it.

Alright.

[Jammer7]

8 hours ago, Roll Tide said:

I don’t get the Elias love affair with Harvey. He’s washed up to say the very least and was involved in drugs that killed a teammate 

As far as I have read, the few pills he gave the deceased player we’re not used and did not, in any way, contribute to his death. That is a false narrative. Giving/sharing with someone prescription scheduled drugs is a crime, yes. He is guilty of that, but has not been charged with a crime like the vast majority of the people in the world who share their prescriptions with other people. If you think this doesn’t happen all over the place, in all walks of life, you are mistaken.  I am not condoning his actions, but it happens a lot. 

Someone please correct me if I am mistaken about the facts of this case. Provide a link as well. Otherwise, can we please stop this. 

Whatever his past with the Mets, he was a solid vet for us last year. 

[Roll Tide]

9 hours ago, Jammer7 said:

As far as I have read, the few pills he gave the deceased player we’re not used and did not, in any way, contribute to his death. That is a false narrative. Giving/sharing with someone prescription scheduled drugs is a crime, yes. He is guilty of that, but has not been charged with a crime like the vast majority of the people in the world who share their prescriptions with other people. If you think this doesn’t happen all over the place, in all walks of life, you are mistaken.  I am not condoning his actions, but it happens a lot. 

Someone please correct me if I am mistaken about the facts of this case. Provide a link as well. Otherwise, can we please stop this. 

Whatever his past with the Mets, he was a solid vet for us last year. 

Fentanyl ultimately killed Skaggs but he was apparently using all kinds of stuff. Harvey admitted to giving him Percocet. His admission should be enough to charge him for the distribution. So I’m not sure why he hasn’t been charged. It may have something to do with the statute of limitations is California. You have to assume that Skaggs took something given to him by Harvey at some point. Not doing so would be naive to say the least.
 

I know drug sharing is illegal and agree that it does happen frequently. But, do you think that makes it ok?

Solid? LOL ….he was a below replacement level pitcher with a 6.27 ERA. You can get 127 innings of that production from any number of scrap heap or AAAA pitchers that they could’ve picked up. Unless you plan was to lose and a guy like Harvey was certainly a key contributor in that endeavor.

A washed up pitcher with baggage …. No thanks

 

I won’t give Elias a pass on Harvey in any way, shape, or form. He picked up a washed up pitcher who is guilty by his own admission of a crime. 
 

Finally, Did he make more sense than Cueto? The answer is an emphatic no unless you are trying to lose. I believe Elias went into this season intending on tanking again but the team has by all accounts exceeded expectations despite still being a sub 500 team.

 

 

[MurphDogg]

20 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Fentanyl ultimately killed Skaggs but he was apparently using all kinds of stuff. Harvey admitted to giving him Percocet. His admission should be enough to charge him for the distribution. So I’m not sure why he hasn’t been charged. It may have something to do with the statute of limitations is California. You have to assume that Skaggs took something given to him by Harvey at some point. Not doing so would be naive to say the least.

Harvey received immunity from the government in exchange for his testimony.

[sportsfan8703]

28 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

Fentanyl ultimately killed Skaggs but he was apparently using all kinds of stuff. Harvey admitted to giving him Percocet. His admission should be enough to charge him for the distribution. So I’m not sure why he hasn’t been charged. It may have something to do with the statute of limitations is California. You have to assume that Skaggs took something given to him by Harvey at some point. Not doing so would be naive to say the least.
 

I know drug sharing is illegal and agree that it does happen frequently. But, do you think that makes it ok?

Solid? LOL ….he was a below replacement level pitcher with a 6.27 ERA. You can get 127 innings of that production from any number of scrap heap or AAAA pitchers that they could’ve picked up. Unless you plan was to lose and a guy like Harvey was certainly a key contributor in that endeavor.

A washed up pitcher with baggage …. No thanks

 

I won’t give Elias a pass on Harvey in any way, shape, or form. He picked up a washed up pitcher who is guilty by his own admission of a crime. 
 

Finally, Did he make more sense than Cueto? The answer is an emphatic no unless you are trying to lose. I believe Elias went into this season intending on tanking again but the team has by all accounts exceeded expectations despite still being a sub 500 team.

 

 

Harvey didn’t hold a gun to Skaggs’ head and make him take pills. 

[NCRaven]

19 hours ago, Moose Milligan said:

Good points, and I agree.  Harvey might be the best option at some point here, I don't dispute that.  However, I don't believe he should have been here in the first place.

I'm being as fair as I can here, apparently he was a great teammate last year and the younger guys on the staff liked him and thought he helped out.  

This why I think you’re over estimating the controversy/drama related to a Harvey promotion.  I don’t think the players or most fans will care-as long as he doesn’t totally suck.

[Moose Milligan]

2 minutes ago, NCRaven said:

This why I think you’re over estimating the controversy/drama related to a Harvey promotion.  I don’t think the players or most fans will care-as long as he doesn’t totally suck.

What's done is done.  He's in the system, he'll probably get promoted at some point.

But that's not what I was talking about.  I was talking about his signing in the first place.

[Frobby]

2 minutes ago, NCRaven said:

This why I think you’re over estimating the controversy/drama related to a Harvey promotion.  I don’t think the players or most fans will care-as long as he doesn’t totally suck.

Very few fans will care, and many won’t even know.   I would not have signed Harvey because I don’t think he’s any good and so who needs the extra headache.  But we did sign him, and we probably will need him to throw some innings for this team.   So, I will just hope he exceeds my expectations and does better than last year.