Who should come to the majors and when? Who should be traded?

[Aristotelian]

5 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Have to manipulate his service clock.

That's more important than winning.

I know you are being facetious, but even if you wanted an extra year of Holliday you would not wait until opening day '25. That really makes zero sense.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

I know you are being facetious, but even if you wanted an extra year of Holliday you would not wait until opening day '25. That really makes zero sense.

Huh?

I was responding to waiting until August 2024 (Like Gunnar).

[baltimoriole]

3 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Start with the low hanging fruit. Frazier will be gone. That should create an opening for an infielder, and a need for a lefty bat. Long term, Holliday would be the perfect fit for that spot, but if Elias wants to keep Holliday down, he could start with Ortiz.

Next up, Mateo/Urias. Both guys offer versatility and positive WAR overall productions, but not much beyond that. Mateo is already making $2M and will be slightly more expensive. Then again, Urias might have slightly more trade value. I think one of them will not be with us on opening day, creating a second opening.

On a net basis, then, we would need two infielders, preferably one lefty and one righty. I think Ortiz should be one of the two on opening day. Holliday almost certainly will be the other by the end of the year, but the question is when. 

One guy we haven't talked much about is O'Hearn. He started to regress by the end of the year and hit a wall in the playoffs. Feels like he may have hit his peak and even that added up to only 1.2 WAR. He will be due an arb raise, and do we even have room for a strict platoon 1B? He could be nontendered or traded for minimal return. That could open a spot for Cowser or Kjerstad to enter the OF/DH rotation on opening day. That would leave us thin at 1B but see if Elias continues to stockpile 1B types along with Diaz/Lester at Norfolk. 

I'd trade Urias and keep Mateo. Both had bad years with the bat. Both regressed defensively. But Mateo can play a premium position, has speed, and at least showed over the last month or so, can hit LHP a bit. Not sure what value Urias provided this year. I'd be comfortable with an IF rotation of Henderson, Holliday, Westburg, Ortiz, Mateo, Mountcastle for LHP and Santander for RHP.

[RZNJ]

I look to move Hays but keep Santander.   I’d look to open up next year with Cowser in LF, Mullins in CF, and Santander in RF.   I would have Kjerstad as DH but still getting reps in both COF spots.    Westburg as starting 2B.   Mayo and Holliday starting at Norfolk.   The future of the IF and Westburg depends where Mayo and Holliday wind up.   We will be pretty LH heavy so McKenna and Hicks might be good to have around again.    Ortiz takes Mateo place as backup IF.    Norby and Stowers?   Traded or return to Norfolk.  I don’t see how either make the team.

Mayo and/ or Holliday could be up as soon as May.

[Aristotelian]

11 minutes ago, baltimoriole said:

I'd trade Urias and keep Mateo. Both had bad years with the bat. Both regressed defensively. But Mateo can play a premium position, has speed, and at least showed over the last month or so, can hit LHP a bit. Not sure what value Urias provided this year. I'd be comfortable with an IF rotation of Henderson, Holliday, Westburg, Ortiz, Mateo, Mountcastle for LHP and Santander for RHP.

I don't disagree, but the counterpoint is that Ortiz can handle SS, so Mateo's defense really isn't needed, even on a backup basis, and Urias is way more consistent offensively. I'd be fine keeping Urias if Mateo got us something back in trade, or Mateo's extra money was put toward pitching. We could get rid of both but I think Elias/Hyde will want to keep some continuity and have a low ceiling/high floor guy to fall back on in case of injury. 

[SilverRocket]

I wasn't impressed with Cowser's CF defense, and would be inclined to keep Mullins there with Bradfield as his eventual replacement.

Outfield of: Cowser, Mullins, Kjerstad

Infield of: Mayo, Gunnar, Holliday. Ortiz can play anywhere and give guys days off. 1B would just be whoever we keep out of Mountcastle, Santander, O'Hearn or any short-term signing.

Trade: Westburg, Norby, Urias, Mateo, Hays.

Westburg and Ortiz could also be swapped, if Ortiz turns out to have a higher trade value because of his ability to play SS. baseballtradevalues.com puts Westburg higher currently.

The timeline is tough to handle here because I don't think the team is inclined to hand a starting role to anyone currently in the minors rather than play for it in spring training.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

36 minutes ago, baltimoriole said:

My hope is Cowser takes over LF and they trade Hays. We're stuck with Mullins one more year. No one in the system can play CF and Bradfield needs at least a year to work his way up (fingers crossed).

Unrelated, I enjoyed O'Hearn's career year, but the chances of repeating his 2023 performance are what, 5%?

I'd prefer an outfiled of Cowers, Mullins, Kerjstad with Santander DH and platoon 1b when a righty is pitching. Keep Mountcastle.

I think they need to move on from O'Hearn and free up at bats for Kjerstad. O'Hearn was a nice story, but he's platoon bat at best and Kjerstad (and Mayo) has a much higher ceiling let him develop.

[baltfan]

47 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

You are going to wait on bringing up the best prospect in the sport until the end of the year when there is a reasonable argument that he can make the OD roster?  Why?

Because we have three guys that are also excellent, though not as excellent and we need to see what we have.  Also, he needs to work on his fielding and at second.  I am not the only one that thinks there is no way he is up for Opening Day.  @Tony-OH has said the same.

[Billy F-Face3]

I honestly believe that Santander is more valuable to us all the way up through his free agency than he is anything we would get in a trade for him.  His bat is just too important for the offense. And that power bat something that we have been severely lacking in the lineup so taking him out of it significantly weakens the offense. 

Hays is a streaky player in his own right. He plays like a hall if famer in the 1st half of the season then disappears for long stretches the 2nd half. However, he plays every day and his glove is top of the league playing left field. He helps to boost the defense.

Trading away players to rely on unproven prospects is a risky business because you just don't know if you can count on the young talent, but you do know what you're getting from the vets already on the team. 

We still have the (good) problem of too many players, and not enough spots to play them.  That problem is what is forcing the issue.

[Sports Guy]

1 minute ago, baltfan said:

Because we have three guys that are also excellent, though not as excellent and we need to see what we have.  Also, he needs to work on his fielding and at second.  I am not the only one that thinks there is no way he is up for Opening Day.  @Tony-OH has said the same.

Not making the team on OD and essentially waiting until Labor Day are 2 completely different things.

[DirtyBird]

45 minutes ago, baltimoriole said:

My hope is Cowser takes over LF and they trade Hays. We're stuck with Mullins one more year. No one in the system can play CF and Bradfield needs at least a year to work his way up (fingers crossed).

Unrelated, I enjoyed O'Hearn's career year, but the chances of repeating his 2023 performance are what, 5%?

I'd prefer an outfiled of Cowers, Mullins, Kerjstad with Santander DH and platoon 1b when a righty is pitching. Keep Mountcastle.

LF is a more premium position than CF for us now. Hays did a nice job out there. Mullins has great range, but he has no arm and it looks like he has shown what he is at the plate. Plus he’s another left handed bat, when we need more balance through the lineup.

Give me Hays in RF and Cowser in CF, and trade Mullins

[dzorange]

Not trading Mullins. Under contract for two more years. Really good value. Injuries are a concern but he's a much better hitter than his numbers showed this year. A 3.0 WAR kind of guy each year. At minimum, wait a year to trade him.

I don't mind getting rid of O'Hearn, Urias or Mateo. I think O'Hearn stays, though. I don't see the point of trading him. How much value does he have?

I actually would like to trade Hays the most. I'd like to bring back Hicks for depth.

 

Westburg - He played all three postseason games. I think the O's like him and he stays as a starter at 2B.

Ortiz - I think he's gone. If he's just going to be a 4th infielder, then trade him as opposed to Mateo or Urias who have far less trade value.

Kjerstad - Need his bat. Needs consistent playing time early next year

Mayo - Midseason call up

Holliday - Permanent SS whenever he gets the call

Cowser - Needs PT early next year at the MLB level

Norby - Hold

Stowers - Good as gone

 

C - Rutschman

1B - Mountcastle

2B - Westburg

3B - Henderson

SS - Holliday

LF - Cowser

CF - Mullins

RF - Santander/Kjerstad

DH - Santander/Kjerstad

B - McCann

B - Hicks

B - O'Hearn

B - one of Mateo/Urias

 

This is assuming no FA signings. I think you're holding on most of the MLB level players until the prospects are ready. You can trade them midseason if/when the time comes.

Edited October 11, 2023 by dzorange

[Sports Guy]

I don’t think you trade  Mullins because you don’t have a capable replacement and his bat suffered this year because of his injuries.  
 

Now, if you can get Robert and Mullins still has good enough trade value to justify moving him, I could see that scenario but otherwise, I think you keep him and hope he builds his value back up while still being a 3+ WAR guy for you in 2024.

[Roll Tide]

1 hour ago, DirtyBird said:

No, Cowser takes Mullins spot in CF on OD

Mayo up on OD

Cowser is not a CF, did you even watch the games?

[spleen1015]

Gunnar, Westburg, Ortiz, Norby & Mayo are on the OD roster. I'm not offering Mateo arbitration. He's not worth it. I want that money for FA. Same with Urias.

Gunnar is starting SS and Westburg is starting 2B no matter what coming out of spring training for me next year.

Holliday, I'm giving him some time in Norfolk. If he does well, I bring him up and send down the worst of the 5 above not named Gunnar.

I would try to trade Hays in the offseason so that I can have LF for Kjerstad/Cowser/Stowers, but I also need to find a RH bat for LF. 2 of these 3 are on the OD roster along with Mullins/Santander/McKenna.

Other than Gunnar, we really need 3 of these guys to establish themselves as MLB hitters.