Cade Povich 2024

[interloper]

[OriolesMagic83]

2 hours ago, HuskerFan said:

65% works.

61% works. 

60% works. 

Cold.  Hard. Data. 

You're new here.  No one has ever won an argument with Sports Guy no matter how much the facts are on his side.

[sportsfan8703]

It’s hard to see a path where Povich would ever be anything for us than depth/up down guy. Basically Zimmerman 2.0. There’s only 5 rotation spots and we’re win now mode. Also, as a reliever he might not be as good as what we have in Vespi. 

No knock on Povich. We have a top 3 26 and 40 man roster in the sport. An optionable depth piece with our Wall would be ok, but we’d probably get more value to use him as a trade chip either at the deadline, or offseason, to get a reliever or in a package for a better SP. 

Maybe we see Zimmerman and Povich packaged together for a reliever like Kopech. Just spitballing a name we’re familiar with. 

Edited May 3 by sportsfan8703

[ChosenOne21]

14 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

It’s hard to see a path where Povich would ever be anything for us than depth/up down guy. Basically Zimmerman 2.0. There’s only 5 rotation spots and we’re win now mode. Also, as a reliever he might not be as good as what we have in Vespi. 

No knock on Povich. We have a top 3 26 and 40 man roster in the sport. An optionable depth piece with our Wall would be ok, but we’d probably get more value to use him as a trade chip either at the deadline, or offseason, to get a reliever or in a package for a better SP. 

Maybe we see Zimmerman and Povich packaged together for a reliever like Kopech. Just spitballing a name we’re familiar with. 

We've had about a million starting pitcher injuries. Burns and Means are gone after the season. There's plenty of opportunity.

[baltfan]

1 hour ago, sportsfan8703 said:

It’s hard to see a path where Povich would ever be anything for us than depth/up down guy. Basically Zimmerman 2.0. There’s only 5 rotation spots and we’re win now mode. Also, as a reliever he might not be as good as what we have in Vespi. 

No knock on Povich. We have a top 3 26 and 40 man roster in the sport. An optionable depth piece with our Wall would be ok, but we’d probably get more value to use him as a trade chip either at the deadline, or offseason, to get a reliever or in a package for a better SP. 

Maybe we see Zimmerman and Povich packaged together for a reliever like Kopech. Just spitballing a name we’re familiar with. 

Sorry, it's kinda insane to argue that a guy that is effective for 5 innings won't be as good as a reliever who is sometimes good for 1.  

[sportsfan8703]

16 minutes ago, baltfan said:

Sorry, it's kinda insane to argue that a guy that is effective for 5 innings won't be as good as a reliever who is sometimes good for 1.  

A reliever for us. He’d be behind Coloumbe, Akin, Perez, and Vespi. We have a really good team. It’s crazy to just assume that the next prospect is always going to be better than what we currently have. We’re not just going to cast aside successful and trusted relievers to ride with Povich that may be our 5th best LH RP. It would be best for him to go to a team that isn’t trying to win on a nightly basis and see if his stuff plays at the MLB level. 

Just because someone is an Orioles farmhand doesn’t give them a super power. They need to be able to get MLB hitters out with stuff. Nothing against Povich, I root for him, but we just DFA’d Yohan Ramirez that probably has a more playable arsenal out of the pen than Povich would. 97 with a plus sweeper. 

Povich seems like Zimmerman 2.0. Hope he finds a stuff uptick. But it is what it is. 

Edited May 3 by sportsfan8703

[baltfan]

3 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

A reliever for us. He’d be behind Coloumbe, Akin, Perez, and Vespi. We have a really good team. It’s crazy to just assume that the next prospect is always going to be better than what we currently have. We’re not just going to cast aside successful and trusted relievers to ride with Povich that may be our 5th best LH RP. It would be best for him to go to a team that isn’t trying to win on a nightly basis and see if his stuff plays at the MLB level. 

Just because someone is an Orioles farmhand doesn’t give them a super power. They need to be able to get MLB hitters out with stuff. Nothing against Povich, I root for him, but we just DFA’d Yohan Ramirez that probably has a more playable arsenal out of the pen than Povich would. 97 with a plus sweeper. 

Povich seems like Zimmerman 2.0. Hope he finds a stuff uptick. But it is what it is. 

You rightly listed ahead of Povich the guy that is probably closest to him--Coloumbe.  Coloumbe is an excellent reliever.

Zimmerman was never talked up by management like Povich.  Zimmerman was never a top 100 prospect on any prospect list like Povich.  Zimmerman and Povich are currently on the same team and one is clearly superior to the other.  

 

[Sports Guy]

2 hours ago, sportsfan8703 said:

It’s hard to see a path where Povich would ever be anything for us than depth/up down guy. Basically Zimmerman 2.0. There’s only 5 rotation spots and we’re win now mode. Also, as a reliever he might not be as good as what we have in Vespi. 

No knock on Povich. We have a top 3 26 and 40 man roster in the sport. An optionable depth piece with our Wall would be ok, but we’d probably get more value to use him as a trade chip either at the deadline, or offseason, to get a reliever or in a package for a better SP. 

Maybe we see Zimmerman and Povich packaged together for a reliever like Kopech. Just spitballing a name we’re familiar with. 

I’m not sure how you can say this.  He is making great strides.  As of right now, he’s a better pitching prospect than McDermott because he’s making the necessary adjustments and McDermott isn’t.  I think that could change but that’s where we stand today.

I like DeLeon more than anyone in our system but Povich will get starts in Baltimore this year if he continues to show progress and is healthy.

[sportsfan8703]

3 minutes ago, baltfan said:

You rightly listed ahead of Povich the guy that is probably closest to him--Coloumbe.  Coloumbe is an excellent reliever.

Zimmerman was never talked up by management like Povich.  Zimmerman was never a top 100 prospect on any prospect list like Povich.  Zimmerman and Povich are currently on the same team and one is clearly superior to the other.  

 

You can’t throw a top 100 prospect ranking at a batter to get him out?

It’s ok to have differing opinions on players. Who knows who is right?

But… Povich is not like Coloumbe. Coloumbe throws way harder and has way better control. I’d say he’s even a step behind Vespi. Vespi has good MLB numbers and would probably be in the majors right if he wasn’t in our org. 

A Povich comp might be Drew Rom, but that’s my opinion and it’s nothing personal. 

[sportsfan8703]

9 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I’m not sure how you can say this.  He is making great strides.  As of right now, he’s a better pitching prospect than McDermott because he’s making the necessary adjustments and McDermott isn’t.  I think that could change but that’s where we stand today.

I like DeLeon more than anyone in our system but Povich will get starts in Baltimore this year if he continues to show progress and is healthy.

I appreciate that take. Overall, Neither of McDermott, Povich, and Johnson, are starters. Definitely not starters for a team that looks like it will be a perennial 100ish win team for a few years.  For us, they’re going to be relievers or trade bait.  Just like Drew Rom last year.

If we’re ranking them as relievers then I’m going with McDermott, Johnson, and Povich in that order. Not every failed/flawed starter just magically turns into a reliever. I don’t see a dominant, or even an above average MLB pitch for Povich to use as a carrying tool in the MLB. But maybe he gets a chance to start for a team like Rom did last year and see.

We can agree to disagree, and I hope I’m wrong. 

Edited May 3 by sportsfan8703

[CaptainRedbeard]

Povich is not really comparable at all to Zimmerman or Rom. Povich doesn’t have a ton of velo on his fastball, but still more than those two and much better spin rate. Zimmerman and Rom really only have plus sliders, and everything else is bad, and Rom didn’t even throw his changeup. 

Povich a full arsenal of 5 pitches and his fastball/cutter combo for hard offerings are much better than the typical junkballer lefty that gets exposed at the MLB level, even if they end up below average overall.

Arsenal-wise, Povich is more similar to Irvin than anybody else the Orioles have had recently, and he’s probably still got a better 4 seamer than Irvin (Irvin maybe better velo, but much worse spin). Povich doesn’t have the sinker but has a better curve and a slider/sweeper that Irvin doesn’t have, so he has much more upside for swing and miss. But there’s a huge difference in approach obviously, as Irvin is a strike-thrower and Povich is much more of a nibbler. 

[RZNJ]

1 hour ago, sportsfan8703 said:

You can’t throw a top 100 prospect ranking at a batter to get him out?

It’s ok to have differing opinions on players. Who knows who is right?

But… Povich is not like Coloumbe. Coloumbe throws way harder and has way better control. I’d say he’s even a step behind Vespi. Vespi has good MLB numbers and would probably be in the majors right if he wasn’t in our org. 

A Povich comp might be Drew Rom, but that’s my opinion and it’s nothing personal. 

Coulombe throws way harder than Povich?    Where did you come up with that?

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Povich seems like Zimmerman 2.0. Hope he finds a stuff uptick. But it is what it is. 

That is a ludicrous take.  At the AAA level, Zimmermann has a 4.28 ERA and averages 9.0 K/9.   Povich (including last year) has a 3.59 ERA and 11.4 K/9.   And he appears to be taking a giant leap this year.   

Also, one should never confuse raw fastball velocity with “stuff.”   It’s unrealistic to expect a big jump in velocity for Povich, but his stuff is just fine, thank you.  

As for Povich helping the Orioles in 2024, we’ll see.  Right now, most things are clicking for the O’s starters and even with GRod on the IL we have 6 guys for 5 slots.  Then there’s Wells, who will be back at some point.   So, I’d agree that Povich’s debut isn’t imminent despite his AAA success.  But he’s an enticing prospect, and no Zimmermann 2.0.   
 

 

[Spy Fox]

4 hours ago, sportsfan8703 said:

It’s hard to see a path where Povich would ever be anything for us than depth/up down guy. Basically Zimmerman 2.0. There’s only 5 rotation spots and we’re win now mode. Also, as a reliever he might not be as good as what we have in Vespi. 

No knock on Povich. We have a top 3 26 and 40 man roster in the sport. An optionable depth piece with our Wall would be ok, but we’d probably get more value to use him as a trade chip either at the deadline, or offseason, to get a reliever or in a package for a better SP. 

Maybe we see Zimmerman and Povich packaged together for a reliever like Kopech. Just spitballing a name we’re familiar with. 

Are you talking about just this year? If so you're probably right about him being an up/down guy because there are so many guys ahead of him. 

But I see 1-2 rotation spots up for grabs next year even if all our current options are healthy. Povich has a clear path to the O's rotation in 2025 and beyond, if he continues to perform. 

[interloper]

2 hours ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Povich seems like Zimmerman 2.0. Hope he finds a stuff uptick. But it is what it is. 

Swing and a miss on this one partner.