Jim Palmer Career WAR

[RZNJ]

By chance I decided to check career WAR leaders in baseball history.   Keep in mind this is WAR calculation by Baseball Reference.

I was a little surprised to see many of Palmers contemporaries and, even more so, more recent pitchers comfortably ahead of him.  Palmer wasn’t a strikeout pitcher.  I guess that’s why?

https://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/WAR_pitch_career.shtml
 

Palmer is ranked 38th with 67.6

Mussina is 23 with 82.8

Bert Blyleven is 12 with 96.1

Tom Seaver is 7th with 106

Ferguson Jenkins, Gaylord Perry, Steve Carlton, Nolan Ryan easily ahead of him.

 

 

[Greg Pappas]

That is surprising.

[OriolesUpAndDowns]

To bad they don’t give extra WAR for never giving up a grand slam

[HandsomeQuack]

Baseball Reference uses the difference between a pitcher's runs allowed and the expected runs allowed by an average pitcher in calculating WAR. The latter calculation includes things like park factors and quality of defense. Because the defenses behind Palmer were very good, they estimate that an average pitcher would also allow relatively few runs, and this drives down Palmer's WAR a bit.

[Say O!]

48 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

By chance I decided to check career WAR leaders in baseball history.   Keep in mind this is WAR calculation by Baseball Reference.

I was a little surprised to see many of Palmers contemporaries and, even more so, more recent pitchers comfortably ahead of him.  Palmer wasn’t a strikeout pitcher.  I guess that’s why?

https://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/WAR_pitch_career.shtml
 

Palmer is ranked 38th with 67.6

Mussina is 23 with 82.8

Bert Blyleven is 12 with 96.1

Tom Seaver is 7th with 106

Ferguson Jenkins, Gaylord Perry, Steve Carlton, Nolan Ryan easily ahead of him.

 

 

A couple of things to consider:

• in general, pitcher career WAR is much lesser than hitters.  For context, Palmers 38th pitcher WAR of 67.8 would fall at 86th overall if in the hitters only category 
• while we may remember his CY years with 300+ innings, Palmer amassed <4k innings for his career. Some of the contemporaries cited threw >5k.
• Cakes walked a ton of guys and is also disadvantaged in WAR metrics because the Os defense was historically great (Brooks, Belanger) and vgood (Blair, Grich, etc)

[emmett16]

I heard he never gave up a grand slam.  

[RZNJ]

36 minutes ago, Say O! said:

A couple of things to consider:

• in general, pitcher career WAR is much lesser than hitters.  For context, Palmers 38th pitcher WAR of 67.8 would fall at 86th overall if in the hitters only category 
• while we may remember his CY years with 300+ innings, Palmer amassed <4k innings for his career. Some of the contemporaries cited threw >5k.
• Cakes walked a ton of guys and is also disadvantaged in WAR metrics because the Os defense was historically great (Brooks, Belanger) and vgood (Blair, Grich, etc)

1.  That’s why I only did it by pitchers

2. Good point on the innings.   I was surprised that Seaver, who pitched in a 5 man rotation as opposed to Palmer in a 4 man rotation had over 800 more innings.   He did pitch until he was 41.

3. What do you consider walking a ton of guys?  Palmer averaged an even 3 walks per 9 for his career.  Seaver, 2.6.

[now]

1 hour ago, Say O! said:

• in general, pitcher career WAR is much lesser than hitters.  For context, Palmers 38th pitcher WAR of 67.8 would fall at 86th overall if in the hitters only category 

Yet another confirmation of the wisdom of Elias's drafting approach (so far) to favor hitters.