Would you trade Adam Jones even up for these CF's?

[Gofannon]

47 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Look, I don't know if you are just a fan that doesn't want to accept what Adam Jones himself said, but the fact is that Adam Jones said the reason he did not want to be traded was because he did not want to be looked at as a platoon rightfielder going into free agency.

He didn't say anything about "splitting up his family" or "charity work" but he did say exactly that on record.

He literally said this was all about himself. That is the exact definition of being selfish. I really don't understand how anyone doesn't understand this.

I have no ax to grind with Jones. I liked him as a player for a long time and think he's done a lot of great things for the team and the community, but I call them as I see them and yes, Adam Jones' reason for denying his trade was due to selfish reasons alone.
 

Is it possible for a player to invoke his 10/5 rights and not be seen as doing it for selfish reasons?  It is automatically a player doing the opposite of what the team wants to do, so it's an inherently selfish decision.  

And I ask that as someone who is glad he invoked them, is glad he stayed, and thinks the team running John Andreoli out there for the Tampa Bay series to "see what he brings" was a petty treatment of someone who didn't deserve it.

[Chromehill]

1 hour ago, mdbdotcom said:

I supported Adam's decision to not accept the trade. Becoming the weak-side of a platoon for two months instead of remaining the starting center fielder with the O's could have undercut his market value. Maybe it was a bad choice, maybe not. Unlike the rest of us, Adam Jones is not perfect.

Since making that decision, public opinion seems to have turned against AJ. I think that's a shame. During his career in Baltimore, I Adam Jones has done more for the Orioles than the Orioles did for him. I will always appreciate him as one of my favorite Orioles of all time (I attended my first game at Memorial Stadium in 1959) and rank him second only to Paul Blair as the best center fielder in team history. 

I hope the O's give AJ10 a fitting tribute during the final homestand. He doesn't belong in center field anymore, and there's really no place for him on a rebuilding O's team, but I will always think highly of Adam Jones and appreciate everything he's done for the Orioles and the city of Baltimore.

I am not sure how you give a tribute to a guy who could be back with the team next year if the price is right.  Right now, the O's outfield prospects are not ready to take over fulltime in RF and LF.  They probably need to look for solid players they can get on 1 year contracts to man RF and LF in 2019.  Jones could be one of those players.  If he is willing to take a 1 year deal for $5 to $7 mil, I would not be against bringing him back.  I have no idea what is available on the market.  With the team looking at another hundred loss season in 2019, there is no reason to rush the prospects. 

I think most would agree that 2019 cannot have Mancini and Trumbo in RF and LF. 

[Redskins Rick]

51 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

There is no way any sane organisation is going to put a $17 million QO on a 33yr old when they are trying to cut payroll and rebuild. 

Anyone who thinks otherwise is thinking with their hearts and not their minds. I get that fans have their favorites and they are not going always going to think clearly when it comes to their favorite players, but there is a better chance of John Angelos picking up the phone and asking me to take over this organization as there is for the Orioles to offer Jones a QO.

Dang, so if you get GM, there goes my shot at being made manager.

[mdbdotcom]

26 minutes ago, Chromehill said:

I am not sure how you give a tribute to a guy who could be back with the team next year if the price is right.  Right now, the O's outfield prospects are not ready to take over fulltime in RF and LF.  They probably need to look for solid players they can get on 1 year contracts to man RF and LF in 2019.  Jones could be one of those players.  If he is willing to take a 1 year deal for $5 to $7 mil, I would not be against bringing him back.  I have no idea what is available on the market.  With the team looking at another hundred loss season in 2019, there is no reason to rush the prospects. 

I think most would agree that 2019 cannot have Mancini and Trumbo in RF and LF. 

In 2019, playing AJ shouldn't be a priority over playing Mullins, Hays, Stewart, Rickard, Andreoli, Wilkerson or even Mancini in the outfield. It's time to pay Adam a fond farewell.

[OriolesMagic83]

1 hour ago, Tony-OH said:

There is no way any sane organisation is going to put a $17 million QO on a 33yr old when they are trying to cut payroll and rebuild. 

Anyone who thinks otherwise is thinking with their hearts and not their minds. I get that fans have their favorites and they are not going always going to think clearly when it comes to their favorite players, but there is a better chance of John Angelos picking up the phone and asking me to take over this organization as there is for the Orioles to offer Jones a QO.

 

So you're saying there's a chance? 

How about about Frobby for manager and Luke for pitching coach?  Who would be your hitting coach?

[Redskins Rick]

2 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

 

So you're saying there's a chance? 

How about about Frobby for manager and Luke for pitching coach?  Who would be your hitting coach?

Luke is better suited for heading up the advance scouting team.

CoC for pitching coach!

 

[webbrick2010]

1 hour ago, Tony-OH said:

I think there is little doubt that Adam Jones will find a job next year and might even be as a starter, but he's not getting a large three-year or more deal from anyone.

I disagree, I think he will hear a lot of crickets and one big reason it that teams will be scared off by his attitude that he is a starter and concerns that he will not transition well to being a role player. 

[Frobby]

51 minutes ago, Gofannon said:

Is it possible for a player to invoke his 10/5 rights and not be seen as doing it for selfish reasons?  It is automatically a player doing the opposite of what the team wants to do, so it's an inherently selfish decision.  

And I ask that as someone who is glad he invoked them, is glad he stayed, and thinks the team running John Andreoli out there for the Tampa Bay series to "see what he brings" was a petty treatment of someone who didn't deserve it.

I agree with you, and have no problem with a player being selfish in that situation.   He has no contractual or even moral obligation to put the team’s interests ahead of his own in that situation.   

[Tony-OH]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

Agreed, but what would you call “large?”    

Good question. Maybe anything over $8 million? I could see Jones getting a 2yr/$14 million contract from someone needing a bridge to a prospects and has ideas of contending.

[Tony-OH]

57 minutes ago, Gofannon said:

Is it possible for a player to invoke his 10/5 rights and not be seen as doing it for selfish reasons?  It is automatically a player doing the opposite of what the team wants to do, so it's an inherently selfish decision.  

And I ask that as someone who is glad he invoked them, is glad he stayed, and thinks the team running John Andreoli out there for the Tampa Bay series to "see what he brings" was a petty treatment of someone who didn't deserve it.

No, not at all. It's selfish when the player literally states he invoked the clause because he was concerned how he would look entering free agency as a part-time RFer. 

Definition of selfish: A person, action or motiff lacking consideration for others; concerned chiefly with one's own personal profit or pleasure.

This has nothing to do with him invoking his 10/5 right, which he had every right to do, but for the exact reason he stated.

I give Jones all the credit in the world for being bluntly honest. He did for his own selfish reasons and had the right to do it under the collective bargaining agreement. 

[Redskins Rick]

4 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Good question. Maybe anything over $8 million? I could see Jones getting a 2yr/$14 million contract from someone needing a bridge to a prospects and has ideas of contending.

I hate to disagree, but a contending, needs more production than what Jones can provide at the COF, IMO.

But, hell, Ive been wrong many times before.

 

[Tony-OH]

14 minutes ago, webbrick2010 said:

I disagree, I think he will hear a lot of crickets and one big reason it that teams will be scared off by his attitude that he is a starter and concerns that he will not transition well to being a role player. 

Well, I guess we will see. You could be right, but baseball execs seems to be a forgiving lot when they have a need and anyone who is not in a sour mood after playing all year with the Orioles you would have to question their desire to win. Players and coaches are human. Losing sucks no matter how much money you are making.

[TonySoprano]

17 hours ago, Tony-OH said:

The only thing I have to add here is this at least puts to bed the ridiculous idea that this was about Jones not wanting to uproot his family, or leave his charity or that he has the Orioles organization's best interest at heart.

He did this solely for his own personal gain. Case closed. 

Not saying he didn't earn that right, and that he had every right as a 10/5 to do this, but let's be clear, Jones made this decision while thinking about his own self interest. Nothing more, nothing less.

Of course in the end he ended up a part-time right fielder on the worse team in baseball who was being sat for John Andreoli and DJ Stewart.

 

Agree with the above.  Listening to the MASN interview, he went on and on about career reasons, and family was an afterthought.   

Given the assumption that Philly wanted him as a platoon RFer, that tells me they weren't giving up much at all to get him, especially if they might have taken on his salary in the deal.   What could've been on the table?  More international money?  A giftcard for Philly cheesesteaks?  Bottom line, yeah, anything is better than nothing, but I'm not upset at the "missed opportunity."

[Tony-OH]

2 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

I hate to disagree, but a contending, needs more production than what Jones can provide at the COF, IMO.

But, hell, Ive been wrong many times before.

 

Perhaps. I do think Jones is more valuable as a RFer and in the right situation could provide value to a contending club, but I'm really just kinda winging it on the contract numbers. 

[Tony-OH]

5 minutes ago, TonySoprano said:

Agree with the above.  Listening to the MASN interview, he went on and on about career reasons, and family was an afterthought.   

Given the assumption that Philly wanted him as a platoon RFer, that tells me they weren't giving up much at all to get him, especially if they might have taken on his salary in the deal.   What could've been on the table?  More international money?  A giftcard for Philly cheesesteaks?  Bottom line, yeah, anything is better than nothing, but I'm not upset at the "missed opportunity."

Agreed. I don't think the Orioles were getting anything of value back for Jones and for that reason alone I was not upset when he vetoed the trade.

But it doesn't take away from the fact that he did for his own selfish reasons, which is understandable, but doesn't change the fact that he did it for those reasons.