New names on O's GM wishlist include Billy Eppler, David Forst, Thad Levine, etc.

[mcgraw238]

Joking. Need to use smiley faces. I think the O's want to again have a Tuesday presser. We shall see since it went so well this week.

I thought you were kidding, but then I thought you may be trying to bury a little nugget in there.

Sure, any Tuesday will do.

[Brando]

Excuses, but the facts speak louder as Moore came in and was able to do everything Baird couldn't. Moore has drafted better, he's developed better, and he's not made the boneheaded moves Baird did. I refuse to believe ownership was meddling that much and magically stopped with the next guy, it just doesn't happen as you see here in Baltimore, in WAS with Snyder, and in OAK with (RIP) Al Davis.

Moore came in and demanded he have total control over revamping the scouting department, he demanded financial investment, and was given it. Baird wasn't given a plug nickel. In a vacuum everything is easy to paint black and white. Moore also has had his share of bad trades hi-lighted by Leo Nunez for Mike Jacobs. Moore has also been given the authority to pay above slot for draft picks which is a good reason he has been able to stock the system.

[Sports Guy]

To repeat: What is happening in multiple cases is that possible candidates for the Orioles' job are telling others they are not interested.

From Buster.

[allstar1579]

Moore came in and demanded he have total control over revamping the scouting department, he demanded financial investment, and was given it. Baird wasn't given a plug nickel. In a vacuum everything is easy to paint black and white. Moore also has had his share of bad trades hi-lighted by Leo Nunez for Mike Jacobs. Moore has also been given the authority to pay above slot for draft picks which is a good reason he has been able to stock the system.

And every single instance you state it's Baird's fault for not demanding the same. If the owner was willing to do it for one guy, he'd do it for another, it just means Baird wasn't doing his job of making it happen. Look at Bmore, PA isn't going to give up some things to anyone, he's not magically going to change his mind for a new person.

And that Nunez for Jacobs deal really isn't that bad, it was a good risk for a 1B they needed at the time, they got good OBP out of Jacobs, and Nunez had a good save season, but FLA has been trying to trade Leo pretty hard all year, and now there is this mess about him having someone else's identity. If KC suspected that, it's a great move to get rid of him.

[Brando]

And every single instance you state it's Baird's fault for not demanding the same. If the owner was willing to do it for one guy, he'd do it for another, it just means Baird wasn't doing his job of making it happen. Look at Bmore, PA isn't going to give up some things to anyone, he's not magically going to change his mind for a new person.

You really think Baird sat there and didn't ask for it? Glass wants to sell the team after the All Star game and knew he would have to make concessions to get someone in to turn it around. Imagine if Big Pete said, "I'm selling the team in a few years. Lacava can come in and spend what he needs to scout and develop talent, can pay over slot on any draft pick he wants, and can restructure the front office how he wants." That is akin to what took place in Kansas City.

[allstar1579]

You really think Baird sat there and didn't ask for it? Glass wants to sell the team after the All Star game and knew he would have to make concessions to get someone in to turn it around. Imagine if Big Pete said, "I'm selling the team in a few years. Lacava can come in and spend what he needs to scout and develop talent, can pay over slot on any draft pick he wants, and can restructure the front office how he wants." That is akin to what took place in Kansas City.

Yeah I absolutely think Baird thought he knew what he was doing and didn't ask for anything. People often want to blame ownership for not giving failing GMs the tools they need, when usually it's a matter of the GM just not trying. Would Moore have had to revamp the scouting department if Baird had done a good job of bringing in the right people or managing it correctly? I am not up on all the comings and goings in KC, but from the trainwreck it was while Baird was there (and these are hires he absolutely had control over), I can promise you it wasn't a matter of him being hamstrung, he just had the wrong philosophy and made bad hires.

[24fps]

Yeah I feel like the only talent they can get like that would be young un-proven talent, but apparently even they are too smart to take this gig. It's funny how many instances you have out there of guys doing bad jobs, when someone else gets hired that does specifically different things, and then they magically get better, fast. KC going from Baird to Moore, BOS going from Duquette to Theo, TOR going from Riccardi to AA, TEX going from Hart to Daniels.

Yeah, it's amazing how talent makes a difference, except to Peter Angelos for whom loyalty trumps all else if we are to believe what's being reported. It doesn't surprise me at all that younger executives would, en masse, correctly identify Baltimore as a career-ender. This recruiting debacle coupled with hiring a genuine retread would leave no doubt in my mind that this organization deserves to be considered a laughingstock.

[allstar1579]

Yeah, it's amazing how talent makes a difference, except to Peter Angelos for whom loyalty trumps all else if we are to believe what's being reported. It doesn't surprise me at all that younger executives would, en masse, correctly identify Baltimore as a career-ender. This recruiting debacle coupled with hiring a genuine retread would leave no doubt in my mind that this organization deserves to be considered a laughingstock.

That's the talk today, that NO ONE in the league wants this job and they aren't afraid to turn it down or be vocal about it now because no one blames them for not taking the job. In a position like that usually if you turn down a chance at a job, future people will look at that as a red flag and tend to not consider you, but everyone knows the problems in BAL and no one holds anyone to blame for turning it down.

[mweb]

And every single instance you state it's Baird's fault for not demanding the same. If the owner was willing to do it for one guy, he'd do it for another, it just means Baird wasn't doing his job of making it happen. Look at Bmore, PA isn't going to give up some things to anyone, he's not magically going to change his mind for a new person.

And that Nunez for Jacobs deal really isn't that bad, it was a good risk for a 1B they needed at the time, they got good OBP out of Jacobs, and Nunez had a good save season, but FLA has been trying to trade Leo pretty hard all year, and now there is this mess about him having someone else's identity. If KC suspected that, it's a great move to get rid of him.

.297 now qualifies as a good OBP.

[DrungoHazewood]

He had no money to extend the players he traded and everyone knew it, so he had no leverage when trading.

I'm sure there's some truth to that. MacPhail had no reason to believe that Bedard or Tejada were going to extend, yet he still got a lot of talent for them. It's not an exaggeration to say that Baird would have gotten more value by letting those players walk and collecting picks (and keeping Ellis) than executing the trades.

When Baird traded for Neifi his career had been worth 1 WAR over 3000+ PAs. Given where he was in the arb cycle it would have been silly acquire him for a PTBNL.

[DrungoHazewood]

And that Nunez for Jacobs deal really isn't that bad, it was a good risk for a 1B they needed at the time, they got good OBP out of Jacobs, and Nunez had a good save season, but FLA has been trying to trade Leo pretty hard all year, and now there is this mess about him having someone else's identity. If KC suspected that, it's a great move to get rid of him.

The Jacobs deal was abysmal. This was a team that had a 22-year-old Billy Butler and a 24-year-old Kila Ka'aihue, yet traded something of some small value for a replacement-level DH/1B with the intent of playing him over one of the previously mentioned guys. And Jacobs rewarded them by putting up a -1 win season. Moore deserved to be eviscerated for acquiring Jacobs.

[LookinUp]

That's the talk today, that NO ONE in the league wants this job and they aren't afraid to turn it down or be vocal about it now because no one blames them for not taking the job. In a position like that usually if you turn down a chance at a job, future people will look at that as a red flag and tend to not consider you, but everyone knows the problems in BAL and no one holds anyone to blame for turning it down.

Incredible. Just incredible.

[Bradysburns]

That's the talk today, that NO ONE in the league wants this job and they aren't afraid to turn it down or be vocal about it now because no one blames them for not taking the job. In a position like that usually if you turn down a chance at a job, future people will look at that as a red flag and tend to not consider you, but everyone knows the problems in BAL and no one holds anyone to blame for turning it down.

Dear lord. We should just change our nickname to the Baltimore Lepers.

[allstar1579]

.297 now qualifies as a good OBP.

I didn't bother look it up, but somehow I knew as soon as I typed it, I'd be wrong. I thought it was around .350 one year.

The Jacobs deal was abysmal. This was a team that had a 22-year-old Billy Butler and a 24-year-old Kila Ka'aihue, yet traded something of some small value for a replacement-level DH/1B with the intent of playing him over one of the previously mentioned guys. And Jacobs rewarded them by putting up a -1 win season. Moore deserved to be eviscerated for acquiring Jacobs.

I didn't think it was bad as a gap to get to Hosmer. Kila wasn't good, if you saw him in the minors you knew he'd never hit ML pitching. Think Walter Young, HUGE hole in his swing and he chased all the time. Butler can't field to save his life, so if you need a gap to hold off for a year or two why not.

Not saying it was a great trade, I just don't think (and I'm assuming they knew the trouble coming with Nunez) a player they would like to be rid of was a horrible gamble for a bat to plug in at 1B. In comparison it's like taking a flier on Davis, and Koji was a better trade chip than Nunez (although I feel the main target there was Hunter).

Either way, there are about 15-20 reasons to say Moore is infinitely better than Baird, with half of them still in the minors. Any one of those draft picks makes up for a boneheaded trade.

[mweb]

I didn't bother look it up, but somehow I knew as soon as I typed it, I'd be wrong. I thought it was around .350 one year.

I didn't think it was bad as a gap to get to Hosmer. Kila wasn't good, if you saw him in the minors you knew he'd never hit ML pitching. Think Walter Young, HUGE hole in his swing and he chased all the time. Butler can't field to save his life, so if you need a gap to hold off for a year or two why not.

Not saying it was a great trade, I just don't think (and I'm assuming they knew the trouble coming with Nunez) a player they would like to be rid of was a horrible gamble for a bat to plug in at 1B. In comparison it's like taking a flier on Davis, and Koji was a better trade chip than Nunez (although I feel the main target there was Hunter).

Either way, there are about 15-20 reasons to say Moore is infinitely better than Baird, with half of them still in the minors. Any one of those draft picks makes up for a boneheaded trade.

Jacobs, statistically was worse with the glove than Butler. For me, it was more about targeting Jacobs than anything to do with Nunez or having a need(I don't agree with that word either considering how bad they were as a team) for a 1B. Jacobs was a -2 rWAR player over the past two years before the trade. He was going into his age 28 season. Why would he target him? Kila probably could have given them a similar negative WAR for 3 million less.