Orioles Discussing Four-Year Deal With Nick Markakis (Signs w/ATL)

[atomic]

We have different opinions on Lough and Pearce wouldn't be playing everyday. He stayed healthy last year, playing almost everyday in the 2nd half.

If Pearce hits like he did last season he would play everyday and Lough wouldn't platton with him. The problem with this anyway is we also need someone to play left and DH. Is Pearce playing three positions a t once?

[Il BuonO]

Isn't there anyone who believes that Lough/Pearce easily replaces Nick in RF. We need a middle of the order bat. However, even without one, a maturing Manny Machado and a rebounding Chris Davis might be enough. However, it would be nice to have one more bat. I hear Kendrys Morales could come real cheap this year. Last year, it was 50/50 on who was better, Morales or Cruz.

[video=youtube_share;jkm1i2o6Ri8]

Lough in RF, De Aza in LF. It could be Morales year to regain his value like Cruz did last year. Morse is only slightly less attractive as a RH only bat.

[AlbionHero]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/what-are-we-missing-about-nick-markakis/#more-169998

[Rene88]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/what-are-we-missing-about-nick-markakis/#more-169998

Thanks for sharing, scolding report.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Frobby]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/what-are-we-missing-about-nick-markakis/#more-169998

That's a very fair article. I had an interesting day yesterday. I had to drive to the Philadelphia area from Washington, and was in range of Baltimore's 105.7 for about 90 minutes. The fact that Markakis might leave was a big topic of calls, and people were irate. Clearly, people who watch a lot of baseball but don't follow advanced stats have a much higher opinion of Markakis than people who like to rely heavily on advanced stats to evaluate players.

I think what some of these articles and analysts miss is the value of Nick's reliability and consistency. By consistency, I don't mean that he is streak-proof -- far from it. I mean that he brings the same approach at the plate, and the same demeanor, to the ballpark every day. Having a poor day, week or month at the plate won't affect his defense or his intensity. He is almost always going to give you a good at bat where he makes the pitcher throw some strikes, no matter whether he is hot or cold. He comes ready to play every day. He doesn't have much power against lefties, but he is a tough out against them. I think most fans who actually watch Nick play, and his manager, coaches and teammates, find value in these things that isn't necessarily captured by WAR or other stats. I understand how someone can say, "if two guys both produce a .734 OPS (or OPS+, or wOBA, or wRC+, or whatever other stat you want to use), I really don't care about that other stuff," but I think in the real world that other stuff does matter.

[AlbionHero]

All that stuff you just talked about is because he's been here 8 years. He's a steady player. Got it. Average fans talking on the radio just don't get it. Markakis is a "fan favorite". I'm sure a lot of callers were irate when the O's let Roberts sign with the Yanks last year. Tough decisions aren't always popular.

I do understand for a lot of people the joy of rooting for your baseball team extends to the specific players... the guys who have been here a long time you really like to see play and have success. That's fine, but at the same time sometimes those guys might not be the best options for the team as well, especially if the price isn't right.

I think it helps for me that I'm not really too connected with any specific player, and I'm a fan of the Orioles more then the players themselves so I want to get the players I feel have the best chance of producing and help us win, regardless of who they are. For example, I'd have no problem trading Adam Jones for Andrew McCutchen, even though Adam has been my favorite O's plyer the last 5+ years since I feel that would be an upgrade to the team.

[wildcard]

What it comes down to for me is that I think Nick will be fine for two years. But when you have to sign a 4 year contract to retain him, his down turn in production over the last two years make it hard to make that deal if you are the O's management.

Its the same position the O's were in with Nelson. The contract required is too long.

[Frobby]

What it comes down to for me is that I think Nick will be fine for two years. But when you have to sign a 4 year contract to retain him, his down turn in production over the last two years make it hard to make that deal if you are the O's management.

Its the same position the O's were in with Nelson. The contract required is too long.

I'd prefer a 3-year deal, but the 4th year isn't a big deal to me if the salary is reasonable. I really don't think Nick will have a precipitous decline from here. However, the most notable point in the fangraphs article was the data on how far Nick hits the ball, and the pretty serious drop after his injuries in 2012. That drop may be permanent, and if so, probably limits any upside.

[Mayor McCheese]

My guess is Nick is in the woods and doesnt want to be bothered. He'll talk business as soon as hunting season is over.

No, I saw him last week playing outside with his kids.

[wildcard]

I'd prefer a 3-year deal, but the 4th year isn't a big deal to me if the salary is reasonable. I really don't think Nick will have a precipitous decline from here. However, the most notable point in the fangraphs article was the data on how far Nick hits the ball, and the pretty serious drop after his injuries in 2012. That drop may be permanent, and if so, probably limits any upside.

I can't think of one reason to believe that Nick will not decline like most other players between the ages on 31-34.

[Frobby]

I can't think of one reason to believe that Nick will not decline like most other players between the ages on 31-34.

I've given my reasons for my opinions about this in a couple of other threads. And I certainly would not say I expect no decline. I just don't expect anything precipitous.

[jtschrei]

No one can tell me that DeAza is a suitable replacement for Markakis. He's a major downgrade. Major.

I understand not wanting to give Nick a 4 year deal. I do not think there is upside there. We just hope he gives us what he's given us the last 4 years. I don't see that happening.

So where does that leave us? We need to make a trade or overpay Markakis. The FAs out there are not good or the right fits for this team. All I'm saying is that I will be upset if we let Nick walk and run DeAza/Pearce/Lough out there to be the everyday RF.

[Babypowder]

No one can tell me that DeAza is a suitable replacement for Markakis. He's a major downgrade. Major.

I understand not wanting to give Nick a 4 year deal. I do not think there is upside there. We just hope he gives us what he's given us the last 4 years. I don't see that happening.

So where does that leave us? We need to make a trade or overpay Markakis. The FAs out there are not good or the right fits for this team. All I'm saying is that I will be upset if we let Nick walk and run DeAza/Pearce/Lough out there to be the everyday RF.

I'm very confident a Pearce and Lough platoon in right would be better than Nick Markakis.

[AlbionHero]

No one can tell me that DeAza is a suitable replacement for Markakis. He's a major downgrade. Major.

What exactly makes you say this? Its been shown several times by the WAR metrics they are pretty much similar players over the last few years. Steamer projects a higher WAR out of DeAza next year in platoon duty than Markakis in full time duty.

DeAza isn't great. He's pretty much an average player... but so is Nick. To be a "major downgrade" from Nick you pretty much have to be a AAA level player.

[Reboulet'sStache]

I've given my reasons for my opinions about this in a couple of other threads. And I certainly would not say I expect no decline. I just don't expect anything precipitous.

But you also wouldn't expect any upside, right? If Nick is going to go one way or another, it's going to be down. He's not going to spike to some 3 WAR player at any point. At best what you're saying is you would expect Nick to be able to maintain his 2.3ish WAR production?