Zac Lowther

[Frobby]

Lowther threw 5 shutout innings, allowing only 1 hit but walking 4, but striking out 7.    His ERA is back down to 1.96.    

[orioles22]

On 6/10/2019 at 1:05 PM, Ruzious said:

I'm asking about him in particular because he doesn't have great stuff and does know how to pitch to minor leaguers, and I'd really like to know what... SPECIFICALLY... he's going to learn by staying in the minors.  If he gets promoted to AAA, is working against AAA and AAAA type players really going to help him learn to get major leaguers out?  

Does it really bother people (even a WWE fan) that I ask these questions?

 

He may be able to go to Baltimore and be fine, but more than likely he needs time in AAA as part of the natural progression for pitchers. There is no reason to take a chance that rushing him could hurt his development.

[Ruzious]

On 6/14/2019 at 11:41 PM, orioles22 said:

He may be able to go to Baltimore and be fine, but more than likely he needs time in AAA as part of the natural progression for pitchers. There is no reason to take a chance that rushing him could hurt his development.

But why do you assume that having play in the majors now would hurt his development?

[LookinUp]

2 minutes ago, Ruzious said:

But why do you assume that having play in the majors now would hurt his development?

I can't answer for orioles22, but I don't assume it'll "hurt" his development. I just assume there are additional developmental steps to take at AAA, particularly for a guy who can't get away with as many mistakes in the majors as the elite arms.

I don't understand the rush to skip AAA at all, particularly in this rebuild. The whole point is to build all of our the guys the best we can so we have more confidence that every player who graduates to the majors is more or less ready. The old way of doing things was to say that AA success was the barometer and that AAA meant nothing. I like this way better. It just takes a while to build your entire organization up to that standard. It essentially adds another year to many players' development.

[sportsfan8703]

On 6/10/2019 at 2:51 PM, Frobby said:

Lowther struggled in his last outing.    He’s not on the 40-man roster and doesn’t need to be until after next season.   I’m fine with promoting him to Norfolk but wouldn’t dream of having him skip that level and go to the majors.   

There's no point in rushing any of these guys.  I do think that with pitchers though that there are only "so many bullets in the arm".  Not having to be on the 40 man spot this offseason is huge.  I say let him get his feet wet in AAA at the end of the year.  Give him some ST starts in MLB camp and have him debut sometime around next season's ASB or September.  

No point in rushing any of these guys.  

[Ruzious]

1 hour ago, LookinUp said:

I can't answer for orioles22, but I don't assume it'll "hurt" his development. I just assume there are additional developmental steps to take at AAA, particularly for a guy who can't get away with as many mistakes in the majors as the elite arms.

I don't understand the rush to skip AAA at all, particularly in this rebuild. The whole point is to build all of our the guys the best we can so we have more confidence that every player who graduates to the majors is more or less ready. The old way of doing things was to say that AA success was the barometer and that AAA meant nothing. I like this way better. It just takes a while to build your entire organization up to that standard. It essentially adds another year to many players' development.

I would agree with you about a typical wet behind the ears prospect, but I'm talking about Lowther.  Lowther seems to be an exceptionally bright pitcher who knows how to pitch.  In AAA, he would be learning to get AAA batters out.  AAA is loaded with older organizational type players who aren't good enough for the majors.  What works on them won't work on quality major leagues.  He needs to learn how to get major leaguers out, and I think the best - and perhaps only - way to do that is to face them.  At some point, ya gotta go through the trials of being a rookie, and I don't see the point in waiting in his case.  You guys call that rushing him; I disagree - fwiw.           

[Frobby]

18 hours ago, Ruzious said:

I would agree with you about a typical wet behind the ears prospect, but I'm talking about Lowther.  Lowther seems to be an exceptionally bright pitcher who knows how to pitch.  In AAA, he would be learning to get AAA batters out.  AAA is loaded with older organizational type players who aren't good enough for the majors.  What works on them won't work on quality major leagues.  He needs to learn how to get major leaguers out, and I think the best - and perhaps only - way to do that is to face them.  At some point, ya gotta go through the trials of being a rookie, and I don't see the point in waiting in his case.  You guys call that rushing him; I disagree - fwiw.           

We fundamentally disagree about the nature of AAA hitters.    Most of them would crush AA pitching if they faced it.    They got to AAA because they’d mastered AA.    I’d rather have our pitchers learn to get those guys out before they take the next step and have to try getting major leaguers out.    

[Ruzious]

2 hours ago, Frobby said:

We fundamentally disagree about the nature of AAA hitters.    Most of them would crush AA pitching if they faced it.    They got to AAA because they’d mastered AA.    I’d rather have our pitchers learn to get those guys out before they take the next step and have to try getting major leaguers out.    

I don't disagree with you - in general.  That's why I made a point of distinguishing between Lowther and the typical AA player and opened up by saying "I would agree with you about a typical wet behind the ears prospect, but I'm talking about Lowther."  I think you make a mistake by assuming each prospect should be developed the same way with the same preconceived notions.      

[orioles22]

I'd guess that someone thought every pitcher rushed through the minors, only to get bombed in the majors before starting a shuttle back and forth, was different than the normal pitcher.

There's just no point in rushing anyone, especially if you are the Orioles. Let him go to AAA and dominate and then there would be no question that the Orioles did all they should do get him ready.

[Can_of_corn]

3 hours ago, Frobby said:

We fundamentally disagree about the nature of AAA hitters.    Most of them would crush AA pitching if they faced it.    They got to AAA because they’d mastered AA.    I’d rather have our pitchers learn to get those guys out before they take the next step and have to try getting major leaguers out.    

I disagree that "most" would "crush".  We also know that numerous factors go into promotions and it all isn't result based.

[Frobby]

3 hours ago, Ruzious said:

I don't disagree with you - in general.  That's why I made a point of distinguishing between Lowther and the typical AA player and opened up by saying "I would agree with you about a typical wet behind the ears prospect, but I'm talking about Lowther."  I think you make a mistake by assuming each prospect should be developed the same way with the same preconceived notions.      

That is fair, and I do think it depends on the player to a degree. I’m not quite sure what you mean, though, in contrasting Lowther to a “wet behind the ears” prospect.    Lowther has comparatively few pro innings under his belt compared to most AA prospects, and it’s not like he played in a major college conference, either.   He’s thrown 242 pro innings.

[Ruzious]

12 minutes ago, Frobby said:

That is fair, and I do think it depends on the player to a degree. I’m not quite sure what you mean, though, in contrasting Lowther to a “wet behind the ears” prospect.    Lowther has comparatively few pro innings under his belt compared to most AA prospects, and it’s not like he played in a major college conference, either.   He’s thrown 242 pro innings.

I think he's a lot smarter than the average AA pitcher as far as understanding how to pitch, and he comes across as being a mature 23 year old adult who almost seems out of place in the minors.  Batters are hitting .186 against him in AA - which is in line with the rest of his 242 innings.  His ERA is 1.96 which is also in line with his career numbers.  In 6 of his 12 (and 4 of his last 6) games this year - he's given up zero runs.   

[LookinUp]

He has performed for sure, but I still don't understand. Is there anything bad about sending him to AAA? What is gained by promoting him to the majors ASAP? 

[Ruzious]

Lol, I'm going to let this die.  I think I've said everything, and I didn't intend on doing a 1 man crusade here.  

[Can_of_corn]

10 minutes ago, Ruzious said:

Lol, I'm going to let this die.  I think I've said everything, and I didn't intend on doing a 1 man crusade here.  

Those are the most fun.