Appears Grayson pitched his way to AAA to start the year

[Aristotelian]

I have never heard of Stuff+ until this thread. Whether it's made up or not, I also believe in other stats such as ERA, WHIP, K/BB, etc. Alcantara may have had slightly worse Stuff+ but I would much rather have his spring on the other metrics. I wonder if Eno Harris believes in Stuff+ enough to place an even odds bet on Grayson outperforming Alcantara. If not, he just cherry picked a stat to post on Twitter and get clicks from Elias haters. 

[Sports Guy]

I’m wondering if when he came back from the lat injury if he tweaked something mechanically because he was worried about re-injury and then got into a bad habit with it?

[Sports Guy]

2 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

I have never heard of Stuff+ until this thread. Whether it's made up or not, I also believe in other stats such as ERA, WHIP, K/BB, etc. Alcantara may have had slightly worse Stuff+ but I would much rather have his spring on the other metrics. I wonder if Eno Harris believes in Stuff+ enough to place an even odds bet on Grayson outperforming Alcantara. If not, he just cherry picked a stat to post on Twitter and get clicks from Elias haters. 

It’s Sarris’ stat and quite frankly, given the K rate and the idea that we heard from guys that stuff was good, it’s likely true.

Now, I’m not sure what command has to do with stuff+ and that is where the issue lies.

No one is saying he his stuff looked bad.

[Going Underground]

Not sure that this has been posted.Might not agree with Jon Meoli but good to see he is now with the Banner and has experience on the Orioles beat 

 

 

[interloper]

I'm less surprised by the actual decision to option him than I am about Elias' fairly strong, verging on harsh, words for Grayson. He also issued his fair share of compliments about him, of course, but you can really see the frustration in the video interview with Elias. He rattles off all the things that he didn't like - not being able to establish the slider, the lack of command, not being able to get past the 4th inning. He mentions a few times that other guys simply pitched better. And that he expected Grayson to display a "better version of himself". 

I think based on Elias' subtle tone here, it's safe to say he really did expect to have Grayson make the OD roster, and he's annoyed it didn't pan out that way. It does read a little bit like tough love, and it's hard to say if that's by design or if, again, he's just kinda venting. 

 

Edited March 28, 2023 by interloper

[Frobby]

Jon Meoli, now writing for the Baltimore Banner, weighs in on this topic:

https://www.thebaltimorebanner.com/sports/orioles-mlb/jon-meoli-grayson-rodriguez-analysis-mike-elias-KPDPPQ3CLND7HMXZPIDXXDVHWI/

[Aristotelian]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

It’s Sarris’ stat and quite frankly, given the K rate and the idea that we heard from guys that stuff was good, it’s likely true.

Now, I’m not sure what command has to do with stuff+ and that is where the issue lies.

No one is saying he his stuff looked bad.

Agreed, K/9 was normal range for him. I believe Stuff+ is a real thing just question whether it is in itself proof of overall performance. Hopefully that suggests he is healthy and will be up sooner rather than later.

[HakunaSakata]

2 hours ago, Frobby said:

Of course I believe in sabermetrics.  I just don’t believe in Eno Sarris’s sabermetrics.  And I guarantee you that Sig and his staff have better metrics than anything Sarris concocts.  And whatever Sig’s said didn’t put Grayson on the major league roster.   

In looking at Harris' pitching rankings for this coming season it certainly seems like there's a directly corelation between Stuff+ and performance. In his top 40 pitchers the only possibly outlier I see is Rasmussen. And sure he was being a bit snarky in his Twitter post, but it definitely seems like he's put in the work when developing his model. And while Medal might not be using the exact same thing, I'm sure his analysts have developed something similar. Again, I'm a bit indifferent about the decision to start Rodriguez at AAA, but I don't think Harris' should be written off as a nut job either. 

https://theathletic.com/4206001/2023/03/27/starting-pitching-ranks-sarris-2023/

 

[Sports Guy]

1 hour ago, interloper said:

I'm less surprised by the actual decision to option him than I am about Elias' fairly strong, verging on harsh, words for Grayson. He also issued his fair share of compliments about him, of course, but you can really see the frustration in the video interview with Elias. He rattles off all the things that he didn't like - not being able to establish the slider, the lack of command, not being able to get past the 4th inning. He mentions a few times that other guys simply pitched better. And that he expected Grayson to display a "better version of himself". 

I think based on Elias' subtle tone here, it's safe to say he really did expect to have Grayson make the OD roster, and he's annoyed it didn't pan out that way. It does read a little bit like tough love, and it's hard to say if that's by design or if, again, he's just kinda venting. 

 

It wasn’t harsh, it was the truth.

[Sports Guy]

4 minutes ago, HakunaSakata said:

In looking at Harris' pitching rankings for this coming season it certainly seems like there's a directly corelation between Stuff+ and performance. In his top 40 pitchers the only possibly outlier I see is Rasmussen. And sure he was being a bit snarky in his Twitter post, but it definitely seems like he's put in the work when developing his model. And while Medal might not be using the exact same thing, I'm sure his analysts have developed something similar. Again, I'm a bit indifferent about the decision to start Rodriguez at AAA, but I don't think Harris' should be written off as a nut job either. 

https://theathletic.com/4206001/2023/03/27/starting-pitching-ranks-sarris-2023/

 

I have interviewed him in the past on multiple occasions for a podcast I used to do and he’s good. He knows his stuff.

Not judging stuff+ a stat though but I think dismissing it is likely wrong considering the source of the stat.

It may be fair to question it though. But that’s different than dismissing it. 

[deward]

9 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

It wasn’t harsh, it was the truth.

Something can be both true AND harsh

[Sports Guy]

Just now, deward said:

Something can be both true AND harsh

Well they say the truth hurts and most people don’t want to hear it.  I’m glad Elias said it. He didn’t sugar coat it and maybe he was trying to send a message.

[deward]

2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Well they say the truth hurts and most people don’t want to hear it.  I’m glad Elias said it. He didn’t sugar coat it and maybe he was trying to send a message.

I think he was clearly sending a message. I'm fine with what he said, except for the fact that he said it through the media instead of behind closed doors. It's concerning to me that he thought a public calling-out was necessary. It says something about either Elias or Grayson, but I'm not sure which.

[spleen1015]

I watched the video posted earlier in this thread where he made the comments. I didn't think he said them out of frustration or was trying to send any sort of message. He was just answering a question.

[deward]

32 minutes ago, spleen1015 said:

I watched the video posted earlier in this thread where he made the comments. I didn't think he said them out of frustration or was trying to send any sort of message. He was just answering a question.

Fair enough, I was just going off the wording.