Bauer interested in O's

[wildbillhiccup]

24 minutes ago, Sanity Check said:

For those who haven't watched the interviews/links that are on page 8 here, especially those who have pre-judged Bauer as a monster, I think that these basically paint something much different.  And goes to what @Malike says about lies and setups to meet a goal.  This seems to prove that he got a raw deal from a predator who was trying to extort his money.  If you haven't watched, and want to know what this was all about, this stuff is pretty powerful in his favor.

It still doesn't answer the questions about clubhouse presence and positive leadership though.  That's a different, and also important concern.

I'm of the opinion that actions speak louder than words and he still had several "incidents" while playing in Japan last season. 

[wildbillhiccup]

14 minutes ago, ArtVanDelay said:

FWIW, one of the most respected players in MLB, Mookie Betts, called Bauer an “awesome guy”. 

FWIW I have a feeling what was said publicly and what was said behind closed doors are two entirely different things. 

"Two people with knowledge of Dodgers clubhouse dynamics, who are unauthorized to speak publicly about the situation, said that a majority of players do not want Bauer back under any circumstances."

https://www.truebluela.com/2021/7/26/22593021/trevor-bauer-dodgers-teammates-anonymously-distancing

[wildbillhiccup]

1 hour ago, Explosivo said:

Didn’t we sign a similar checkered past in Michael Givens last year? Don’t Orioles fans who are Ravens fans still love Ray Lewis? There are some extremely vocal voices on X who would absolutely freak out if we signed Bauer. It kind of makes me want to see it happen, tbh.

 

Look, the guy was cleared of wrong doing and all one has to do is watch the interview of the “victim” to understand what type of insanity Bauer has dealt with as a result.

moral of the story: don’t dip your dick in crazy.

I'm not sure why you continue to make this about guilt and innocence and to completely dismiss his on field antics and actual projected on field performance which are actual relevant topics to discuss. Stop pushing your hidden Bauer is a patsy agenda. No one cares. 

[Frobby]

5 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

FWIW I have a feeling what was said publicly and what was said behind closed doors are two entirely different things. 

"Two people with knowledge of Dodgers clubhouse dynamics, who are unauthorized to speak publicly about the situation, said that a majority of players do not want Bauer back under any circumstances."

https://www.truebluela.com/2021/7/26/22593021/trevor-bauer-dodgers-teammates-anonymously-distancing

As I said, I leave it to Elias to figure it out.  I’m sure he has way better sources than the internet to determine what kind of presence Bauer would be in the clubhouse.   

[Since1984]

15 hours ago, Sanity Check said:

Wow, I agree.  We don't need that.  I'm not sure he can be a different leader. after seeing that.

I was far more open to a Bauer signing, but after everything that has happened he looses his cool like this?! Pass

[wildbillhiccup]

1 minute ago, Frobby said:

As I said, I leave it to Elias to figure it out.  I’m sure he has way better sources than the internet to determine what kind of presence Bauer would be in the clubhouse.   

That's fine and I'm trying my damndest to focus on the clubhouse / on field implications (which at least seem somewhat relevant), but everyone in this thread seems to be more concerned with making this a social commentary on the persecution of an "innocent" man. 

[Guest]

At risk of getting in trouble with the board, it is pretty fascinating how this subject is dividing the board, MLB and society. It feels like a political question almost, like a pro-life/pro-choice thing - but it isn't, I'm not sure of Bauer's politics and frankly don't care about them. 

Outside of baseball reasons, which I believe are the only valid reason to not sign Bauer (signs of regression in a lesser league in Japan) - when you read the reasonings of why certain fans, posters, and journalists don't want an MLB team to sign Bauer, you soon realize that there is not a single burden of proof he could ever provide to convince them he deserves a second chance otherwise. This has already played out in the courts, and all the evidence that was provided from those hearings and testimonies is still not enough, its all very Kafkaesque. If he was found guilty of anything, if the judge could've found a reason to keep the restraining order, I'd be of the opinion, that no, Bauer shouldn't be signed because there is probable cause something did happen between the parties where he is at fault. Even still there are much worse cases of domestic violence from within MLB (Ozuna, German) in which players returned to playing in a rapid succession compared to Bauer.

So what's it about? Its about projection, virtue signaling, holding luxury positions and a general view within a constellation of opinions that align with other things - the same type of short term thinking that lead the MLB to move the all-star game out of Atlanta over so-called "oppressive voting laws". An earlier comment about "finding it really weird all pro-cop people should have Bauer signed", or however the poster put it, is the low-brow tribal thinking at the base of all of this.

Our society is constructed in a way to allow the courts and justice system to work through their processes. Innocence until proven guilty is a cornerstone of our country. Is it perfect? No, but what's the alternative? Getting Navalny'd? Are people going to be happy with every decision a court or judge makes. Hell no! But we should care about the processes more than we care about the outcomes.

 

Edited February 18 by MDS29

[Orioles West]

This thread is why it’s great to have more time to hang in the Hangout.

This is truly my tribe.

A thread on a player that pulls on both sides of the political spectrum and yet, the primary focus of this thread wanders but falls back to what it should be — whether adding Bauer to the team would be more helpful or hurtful.

Everything from legal aspects, to asking some questions about whether his pitching is worth the potential controversy. All the bases literally covered here.

Personally, I’ve changed my own mind about wanting to give Bauer a chance or not about half a dozen times during the Hot Stove season. No such thing as too much pitching, but these O’s are building a particular teamwork vibe, that I hope continues into this season. Bauer may or may not fit that.

I think this ultimately leaves me in Camp Frobby. I’ll defer to Elias and his info on the guy to decide to bring him on board or not. 

[wildbillhiccup]

4 minutes ago, MDS29 said:

At risk of getting in trouble with the board, it is pretty fascinating how this subject is dividing the board, MLB and society. It feels like a political question almost, like a pro-life/pro-choice thing - but it isn't, I'm not sure of Bauer's politics and frankly don't care about them. 

Outside of baseball reasons, which I believe are the only valid reason to not sign Bauer (signs of regression in a lesser league in Japan) - when you read the reasonings of why certain fans, posters, and journalists don't want an MLB team to sign Bauer, you soon realize that there is not a single burden of proof he could ever provide to convince them he deserves a second chance otherwise. This has already played out in the courts, and all the evidence that was provided from those hearings and testimonies is still not enough, its all very Kafkaesque. If he was found guilty of anything, if the judge could've found a reason to keep the restraining order, I'd be of the opinion, that no, Bauer shouldn't be signed because there is probable cause something did happen between the parties where he is at fault. Even still there are much worse cases of domestic violence from within MLB (Ozuna, German) in which players returned to playing in a rapid succession compared to Bauer.

So what's it about? Its about projection, virtue signaling, holding luxury positions and a general view within a constellation of opinions that align with other things - the same type of short term thinking that lead the MLB to move the all-star game out of Atlanta over so-called "oppressive voting laws". An earlier comment about "finding it really weird all pro-cop people should have Bauer signed", or however the poster put it, is the low-brow tribal thinking at the base of all of this.

Our society is constructed in a way to allow the courts and justice system to work through their processes. Innocence until proven guilty is a cornerstone of our country. Is it perfect? No, but what's the alternative? Getting Navalny'd? Are people going to be happy with every decision a court or judge makes. Hell no! But we should care about the processes more than we care about the outcomes.

Your points are taken, but it's the majority of Bauer supporters who continue to steer the conversation away from on-field, clubhouse, and actual baseball implications. 

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said:

Your points are taken, but it's the majority of Bauer supporters who continue to steer the conversation away from on-field, clubhouse, and actual baseball implications. 

Correct - and I do think his Japanese numbers warrant extreme scrutiny because it did point to regression....but he'd come cheap and the Orioles are in need of pitching. I trust in Elias either way.

[Explosivo]

2 hours ago, wildbillhiccup said:

I did, but it's a bit hard to give it much credence when he's still having incidents as recent as last season. Based on his actions it's pretty clear to me that wherever Trevor Bauer goes he's still going to need to be the center of attention, which is the exact opposite of humility.  

https://nypost.com/2023/07/02/trevor-bauer-throws-tantrum-on-teammates-in-japanese-league/

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2024/jan/17/trevor-bauer-japan-ridge-alkonis-tweet

https://larrybrownsports.com/baseball/trevor-bauer-called-out-japan-disrespectful-celebration-sword/614663

 

Well that’s another thing altogether. Can the guy still pitch? Will the guy negatively affect the clubhouse? Is there a similar guy we can get without all the baggage? These are the questions that really matter and Elias will fairly weigh that decision. It’s unfortunate what happened to him with the crazy lady, but yeah, can the guy pitch still? 
 

as to others who have said “no one cares” well, you responded to the dang post so maybe practice what you preach. and regardless what yall say, this is quite political if the guy can actually still pitch. If he can’t, then well, there are lots of guys who can throw a ball and keep their stuff together.

 

[forphase1]

2 hours ago, Frobby said:

What I would want a police officer to do is to not prejudge either way whether the complainant or other party is telling the truth.   Just investigate and see what the facts show.   

Of course.   Bad situations do happen,  way too often.  And those that commit domestic violence and the like should be punished to the fullest extent of the law in my opinion.   My point is simply I've seen many,  many cases where false claims were made to attempt to get an advantage in divorce, custody and estate proceedings, not to mention CPS and elder care claims.   I've seen lives and reputations ruined by claims that later were proven to be untrue, but by that point the damage was done.   

I'm not really defending Bauer.  I'm not sure I'd want them to sign him,  but that's more from a performance standpoint than anything else.   I just want it known that accusations does not equal guilt and that the misconception that false allegations to the police or courts is a rare occurrence isn't accurate. 

[Aristotelian]

30 minutes ago, MDS29 said:

At risk of getting in trouble with the board, it is pretty fascinating how this subject is dividing the board, MLB and society. It feels like a political question almost, like a pro-life/pro-choice thing - but it isn't, I'm not sure of Bauer's politics and frankly don't care about them. 

Outside of baseball reasons, which I believe are the only valid reason to not sign Bauer (signs of regression in a lesser league in Japan) - when you read the reasonings of why certain fans, posters, and journalists don't want an MLB team to sign Bauer, you soon realize that there is not a single burden of proof he could ever provide to convince them he deserves a second chance otherwise. This has already played out in the courts, and all the evidence that was provided from those hearings and testimonies is still not enough, its all very Kafkaesque. If he was found guilty of anything, if the judge could've found a reason to keep the restraining order, I'd be of the opinion, that no, Bauer shouldn't be signed because there is probable cause something did happen between the parties where he is at fault. Even still there are much worse cases of domestic violence from within MLB (Ozuna, German) in which players returned to playing in a rapid succession compared to Bauer.

So what's it about? Its about projection, virtue signaling, holding luxury positions and a general view within a constellation of opinions that align with other things - the same type of short term thinking that lead the MLB to move the all-star game out of Atlanta over so-called "oppressive voting laws". An earlier comment about "finding it really weird all pro-cop people should have Bauer signed", or however the poster put it, is the low-brow tribal thinking at the base of all of this.

Our society is constructed in a way to allow the courts and justice system to work through their processes. Innocence until proven guilty is a cornerstone of our country. Is it perfect? No, but what's the alternative? Getting Navalny'd? Are people going to be happy with every decision a court or judge makes. Hell no! But we should care about the processes more than we care about the outcomes.

 

I think everyone on the thread understands that the allegation that was dropped is no longer credible. There are many other reasons not to like him and the thread has done a terrific job of staying focused on those.

[G54377]

We don't need to entertain Bauer right now, there are plenty of better pitchers with no baggage still out there. Not even guys who will cost a ton.

[SemperFi]

1 hour ago, MDS29 said:

At risk of getting in trouble with the board, it is pretty fascinating how this subject is dividing the board, MLB and society. It feels like a political question almost, like a pro-life/pro-choice thing - but it isn't, I'm not sure of Bauer's politics and frankly don't care about them. 

Outside of baseball reasons, which I believe are the only valid reason to not sign Bauer (signs of regression in a lesser league in Japan) - when you read the reasonings of why certain fans, posters, and journalists don't want an MLB team to sign Bauer, you soon realize that there is not a single burden of proof he could ever provide to convince them he deserves a second chance otherwise. This has already played out in the courts, and all the evidence that was provided from those hearings and testimonies is still not enough, its all very Kafkaesque. If he was found guilty of anything, if the judge could've found a reason to keep the restraining order, I'd be of the opinion, that no, Bauer shouldn't be signed because there is probable cause something did happen between the parties where he is at fault. Even still there are much worse cases of domestic violence from within MLB (Ozuna, German) in which players returned to playing in a rapid succession compared to Bauer.

So what's it about? Its about projection, virtue signaling, holding luxury positions and a general view within a constellation of opinions that align with other things - the same type of short term thinking that lead the MLB to move the all-star game out of Atlanta over so-called "oppressive voting laws". An earlier comment about "finding it really weird all pro-cop people should have Bauer signed", or however the poster put it, is the low-brow tribal thinking at the base of all of this.

Our society is constructed in a way to allow the courts and justice system to work through their processes. Innocence until proven guilty is a cornerstone of our country. Is it perfect? No, but what's the alternative? Getting Navalny'd? Are people going to be happy with every decision a court or judge makes. Hell no! But we should care about the processes more than we care about the outcomes.

 

On the MLB side not one of us has access to the MLB report on Bauer so this is all largely uninformed speculation.  Bauer is a member of the MLBPA and as such legal status doesn't really matter he-by proxy bargained that away-he is governed by the CBA.  The legal system rarely intervenes in CBA's which is why Bauer has never brought suit.

I don't think much of society cares about Bauer outside of his younger supporters/subscribers who take his que with every social media post complaining that he is innocent and how unfair he is being treated.  Polite, reasoned arguments like your's get lost in all the noise.  

It's just a risky (bad) business decision to sign him.  Anyone who signs him does so realizing that even after his conduct caused him serious consequences he continued his actions again resulting in progressive consequences that eventually cost him his job-that's the very definition of an addiction. 

Edited February 18 by SemperFi