Jackson Holliday 2024

[Sports Guy]

 

[Malike]

1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

 

I saw his 34 ABs on the MLB team, sell high! He's about to bust.

[Spakman]

4 minutes ago, Malike said:

I saw his 34 ABs on the MLB team, sell high! He's about to bust.

Cute

[Sports Guy]

8 minutes ago, Malike said:

I saw his 34 ABs on the MLB team, sell high! He's about to bust.

But they were really bad! 

[Malike]

1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

But they were really bad! 

The worst!

[O's84]

53 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

But they were really bad! 

 

52 minutes ago, Malike said:

The worst!

DFA material! 

[Tony-OH]

On 7/16/2024 at 10:26 AM, banks703 said:

And this is why I don't love OAA .. it also says that Jorge has been -1 at 2B, which, I can't see how that tracks because I've watched literally every game this year and Jorge has been superb with the glove at 2B. OAA suggests that Jorge is the 26th best defensive 2B in baseball. So, yeah.. not buying into OAA. 

 

 

I was a big OAA supporter because it's supposed to be about the metrics of how far a distance a fielding must go and how hard the ball was hit, etc. But the more I've seen of OAA in both the outfield and infield, the more I've been wondering if it needs some tweaking. I still think it gives us a pretty good indication of how good a player is, but I also agree that it can't be taken as the fielding bible of stats.

It would not surprise me if we don't either hear about or see some changes over the next few years. 

[Tony-OH]

On 7/16/2024 at 10:15 PM, Sports Guy said:

Skubal may be the one guy that could cause him to do it.

Not going to lie, I'd trade Holliday for two and half years of Skubal. 

It's not that I don't like Holliday, I do. In fact, as soon as they get him off the dirt I'm going to like him a lot more, but I just think if you can add a young left-handed ace for two and half seasons while were directly in the window, I think you have to go for it. Maybe you ask Detroit to add a Kevin McGonigle while we add in a guy like Luis DeLeon and maybe a Dominican guy like Luis Almeyda. 

[BirdCakes22]

16 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Not going to lie, I'd trade Holliday for two and half years of Skubal. 

It's not that I don't like Holliday, I do. In fact, as soon as they get him off the dirt I'm going to like him a lot more, but I just think if you can add a young left-handed ace for two and half seasons while were directly in the window, I think you have to go for it. Maybe you ask Detroit to add a Kevin McGonigle while we add in a guy like Luis DeLeon and maybe a Dominican guy like Luis Almeyda. 

So you would trade a kid that has the potential to be better than Cal Ripken  for 2.5 years of a #1 pitcher?  I wouldn't even consider it. Our window is not small. I think we'll be better the next several years than this year, and it's because of Holliday and Mayo, Bautista coming back and Bradish. Yes we have a chance to win it all this year, but I wouldn't derail our teams that will have more potential in the future for this year's really good team.

[Malike]

If the team does nothing they are still going to the playoffs and would have a chance to win it all this year. Congrats to whichever team gets hot at the right time.

[Bemorewins]

22 minutes ago, BirdCakes22 said:

So you would trade a kid that has the potential to be better than Cal Ripken  for 2.5 years of a #1 pitcher?  I wouldn't even consider it. Our window is not small. I think we'll be better the next several years than this year, and it's because of Holliday and Mayo, Bautista coming back and Bradish. Yes we have a chance to win it all this year, but I wouldn't derail our teams that will have more potential in the future for this year's really good team.

Question, if we do not add a pitcher at the deadline who can credibly replace Burnes at the top of the rotation next year and if Burnes leaves in FA, how are we going to be better next year? Bradish won't be back until near the end of the season.

Do you think pitching is not that important to contention? Or do you think by adding Holliday and Mayo (and presumably subtracting Santander) we are going to out slug everyone? Do you think Grayson turns into a pitcher as good as Burnes next year? Something else?

[Bemorewins]

7 minutes ago, Malike said:

If the team does nothing they are still going to the playoffs and would have a chance to win it all this year. Congrats to whichever team gets hot at the right time.

The last 25 games we are below .500 (I believe by 3 games) AND we are giving up about 5.6 runs a game. We will need to get awful "hot" or extreme lucky the way things are going now.

But I guess stranger things have happened.

[MDK02]

31 minutes ago, BirdCakes22 said:

So you would trade a kid that has the potential to be better than Cal Ripken  for 2.5 years of a #1 pitcher?  I wouldn't even consider it. Our window is not small. I think we'll be better the next several years than this year, and it's because of Holliday and Mayo, Bautista coming back and Bradish. Yes we have a chance to win it all this year, but I wouldn't derail our teams that will have more potential in the future for this year's really good team.

I think if anyone is going to have a better career than Cal, it will probably be Gunnar.  Thats just my opinion. I think Holliday will be good but I don’t think he’ll be better than Gunnar when it’s all said and done. 

[Tony-OH]

31 minutes ago, BirdCakes22 said:

So you would trade a kid that has the potential to be better than Cal Ripken  for 2.5 years of a #1 pitcher?  I wouldn't even consider it. Our window is not small. I think we'll be better the next several years than this year, and it's because of Holliday and Mayo, Bautista coming back and Bradish. Yes we have a chance to win it all this year, but I wouldn't derail our teams that will have more potential in the future for this year's really good team.

Sometimes you have to give up something to get something and while I like Holliday a lot, Skubel solidifies a rotation that needs help now and in the next few years at a cost that the Orioles will be willing to spend. 

I'm on record as saying I'll live with Mayo's defense at 3B and Westburg should improve if he plays more at 2B. 

If you trade a Holliday, Mayo or Basallo, you need an ace pitcher back with at least two and half years of control. Out of those three, I'd prefer to give up Holliday, but it's not because I don't like him. 

This team is on a 100 win+ pace without Holliday but has lost Bradish, Means, and Wells for the season. I'd feel very good going into a playoff series with Burnes, Skubal, and Rodriguez as the top 3 starters.

[banks703]

14 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Sometimes you have to give up something to get something and while I like Holliday a lot, Skubel solidifies a rotation that needs help now and in the next few years at a cost that the Orioles will be willing to spend. 

I'm on record as saying I'll live with Mayo's defense at 3B and Westburg should improve if he plays more at 2B. 

If you trade a Holliday, Mayo or Basallo, you need an ace pitcher back with at least two and half years of control. Out of those three, I'd prefer to give up Holliday, but it's not because I don't like him. 

This team is on a 100 win+ pace without Holliday but has lost Bradish, Means, and Wells for the season. I'd feel very good going into a playoff series with Burnes, Skubal, and Rodriguez as the top 3 starters.

This post sums up my feelings.

I've beaten to death my feelings on JH as player now and in the future. If he sticks at 2B, I genuinely see Robinson Cano potential offense at the position, which is generational in my opinion. But the O's are stacked (and continue to stack) middle infielders and the need right now (and will be for literally ever) is pitching. If this generational talent can net the O's a player who legitimately increases their chances at the World Series this year plus the next two years, I think I make the move because not only does it probably mean that they won't have to send other high-level talent from the system, but the emergence of JW and Gunnar as All-Star level players (and add in Mayo's potential to not completely butcher third) Holliday's being expendable is better justified.

I realize that some will come unglued at the suggestion that JH, the sport's #1 prospect (who I even describe as a generational talent) may be expendable but it's true. Much like you, it isn't that I don't like the player. I do.. I would not give away his potential just because the IF spots can be filled for the next five years. Skubal, who I am not even over the moon about myself, would give the O's another bonafide TOR pitcher and ease the hurt should Burnes leave in FA after the season. It's a logical move that I think both the O's and Tigers would view as a win-win for both teams, which is what a trade is supposed to accomplish. It'd just depend on what else Detroit wants in addition to Holliday.