Red Sox Working Hard for A-Gon. Why Not Us?

[MemorialStadKid]

Why, because we'll go back to a 5th place team if it blows up?

Wait a minute...

LOL... I thought we were in 3rd...

No answer to my real question...

MSK

[tvz1997]

And MacPhail's plan guarantees us a consistent playoff berth?

We need premium players...AM is a wimp...no gaurantee...AL East SCARY!...what if prospect X never pans out?...

Go on and spin the JTrea wheel and see where is stops.

[VeveJones007]

Would anyone else welcome a Red Sox acquisition of Gonzalez?

1) He just came off a career year. He's good, but not THAT good.

2) Boston would give up a ton.

3) Boston and NY would be set at 1B for the foreseeable future.

That third point is key. That's how Tejada fell in our lap. This is setting up perfectly for a player like Pena or Fielder to be available to the O's for a decent price. I really hope this trade happens.

[SilentJames]

Why, because we'll go back to a 5th place team if it blows up?

Wait a minute...

Because that move doesn't make us any better right here, right now. We are not one magic bat away from competing. You need to let these guys grow, you need to see what you have. If we do what you want us to do we get a rental of A-Gon, lose half our farm system and then fill the holes the trade leaves us with all while being a FOURTH place team.

OR

we could continue going with the young talent we are growing and probably end up a fourth-third place team anyway.

[Mackus]

I will ask this question again, and I believe this is a legitimate question:

If the Red Sox - for example - continue to sign excellent players year after year and continue to keep a strong winning record year after year and the Orioles keep posting losing seasons -

What is the incentive for an excellent player in the 2011 free agent market to sign here if we haven't shown some inkling of a desire to field a winning team?

MSK

If we offer substantially more money, we can overcome not being the most attractive destination. We're going to have to vastly overpay to get guys here, but if we're in the right position and we think they'll be good players for the next several years, that's an ok move.

Also, if we get to .500 this year, we become less like a Kansas City or Pittsburgh and more like a Texas or Toronto or San Francisco. We have to make some minor improvements to have a decent shot at .500, but adding a few intelligent stop gaps like Millwood and maybe guys like Kouzmanoff, Delgado, and Capps, we'll have a good shot.

[JTrea81]

Would anyone else welcome a Red Sox acquisition of Gonzalez?

1) He just came off a career year. He's good, but not THAT good.

2) Boston would give up a ton.

3) Boston and NY would be set at 1B for the foreseeable future.

That second point is key. That's how Tejada fell in our lap. This is setting up perfectly for a player like Pena or Fielder to be available to the O's for a decent price. I really hope this trade happens.

Giants, Dodgers, Mets, Cubs, Cardinals, Brewers and Phillies will all be looking at 1B likely after 2011 if not before then.

[birdman57]

Many people don't have a memory 12 years long and don't realize that jumping at free agents is what got us in this mess in the first place. Albert Belle looked real good back then , maybe better than AGon right now.

Stay on the plan and spend when its time. It's not time now

At least we were a 78 win team back then. We haven't had a sniff of 70 wins for awhile it seems. That said, with a solid FO and excess talent to deal, I see no reason why we couldn't make a competitve bid for AGon. This organization just does not want to spend money. On top of 12 straight losing years, when is enough, enough??????

[JTrea81]

Because that move doesn't make us any better right here, right now. We are not one magic bat away from competing. You need to let these guys grow, you need to see what you have. If we do what you want us to do we get a rental of A-Gon, lose half our farm system and then fill the holes the trade leaves us with all while being a FOURTH place team.

OR

we could continue going with the young talent we are growing and probably end up a fourth-third place team anyway.

I'd prefer to to take the shot at being a playoff team and risk going back to the cellar than a consistent third place team.

Building for anything short of the playoffs is unacceptable.

[Old#5fan]

Of course they are working hard on this.

Functional baseball teams that plan on becoming winners go out and get the best talent available.

A package of two prospects and cash considerations could get the deal done here IF we were working towards getting the guy, but we're not obviously in the mix for any quality free agents.

Once again, we take a back seat to better run organizations.

"I'll have a table scrap salad please." - Andy MacPhail

MSK

Spot on as usual. (Sadly I might add). We sit back and do nothing while our competition sandbags their talent every year and listen to our ultra conservative Scrooge GM say it doesn't matter what Boston and the MFing Yankees do. Does he really expect Oriole fans to be that stupid or naive to buy that?:angryfire:

[MemorialStadKid]

If we offer substantially more money, we can overcome not being the most attractive destination. We're going to have to vastly overpay to get guys here, but if we're in the right position and we think they'll be good players for the next several years, that's an ok move.

Also, if we get to .500 this year, we become less like a Kansas City or Pittsburgh and more like a Texas or Toronto or San Francisco. We have to make some minor improvements to have a decent shot at .500, but adding a few intelligent stop gaps like Millwood and maybe guys like Kouzmanoff, Delgado, and Capps, we'll have a good shot.

Alright, but isn't the conventional argument here that we DON'T have the financial resources to make a move like that if the Yankees and Red Sox get involved?

MSK

[birdman57]

Would anyone else welcome a Red Sox acquisition of Gonzalez?

1) He just came off a career year. He's good, but not THAT good.

2) Boston would give up a ton.

3) Boston and NY would be set at 1B for the foreseeable future.

That third point is key. That's how Tejada fell in our lap. This is setting up perfectly for a player like Pena or Fielder to be available to the O's for a decent price. I really hope this trade happens.

It's this kind of rationale or lack there of that keeps us marred in last place:rolleyes:

[Old#5fan]

If we offer substantially more money, we can overcome not being the most attractive destination. We're going to have to vastly overpay to get guys here, but if we're in the right position and we think they'll be good players for the next several years, that's an ok move.

Also, if we get to .500 this year, we become less like a Kansas City or Pittsburgh and more like a Texas or Toronto or San Francisco. We have to make some minor improvements to have a decent shot at .500, but adding a few intelligent stop gaps like Millwood and maybe guys like Kouzmanoff, Delgado, and Capps, we'll have a good shot.

There is no way on God's green earth this team gets to 500 this year with only the addition of Kevin Millwood, while the Yankees and Boston are adding serious talent and were already miles better anyway if they did nothing! If you or anyone else thinks this you might as well be trying to sell ice cubes to Eskimos!:laughlol:

[Sports Guy]

Typical SG, you assume a player won't ever possibly have a better year than at age 27 in a pitcher's park when they move to a hitter's league. I think I'm underrating AGon frankly.

I am not assuming anything....You are.

However, the fact that you don't see the spike in his BB rate, his ridiculously high HR/FB% and that you don't seem to understand that he was never nearly as good as he was last year, speaks volumes about how much you actually know and your inability to look at and analyze stats.

Its not that AGon can't/won't be a 5-6 win player in Boston, its just that its not likely given a lot of factors.

[Mackus]

At least we were a 78 win team back then. We haven't had a sniff of 70 wins for awhile it seems. That said, with a solid FO and excess talent to deal, I see no reason why we couldn't make a competitve bid for AGon. This organization just does not want to spend money. On top of 12 straight losing years, when is enough, enough??????

Would we be better off in 2012 with nothing or with Matusz, Arrieta, and Reimold?

It'll take an offer like that to get Gonzelez, and then he'll just leave in 2 years when he's a free agent. And you're kidding yourself if you think adding Gonzalez makes us a contender the next two years (while subtracting the aforementioned pieces).

And if you make the argument that we could extend him, I'll make the argument that we could just sign him after 2011. We'd have to compete with more teams to sign him, but there is a much better chance that he signs here after 2011 if we can let our young players play and start winning a bit than there would be to extend him right now if we traded for him.

[Shopay]

Because they didn't offer him market value.

When was the last time one of Boras' superstar clients signed before filing for free agency? What is the percentage of his star clients doing this? So why should we believe AGon will be different?