Vasquez for ACC POY

[BaltimoreTerp]

I guess you dont rememeber reading about how he wasnt getting it done? I do.

Now does this mean he would of been a bust had he not got hurt? No, but he did get hurt and was a bust.No one will know what he would of done.

Kobe was coming out if high school, wasnt ready for the NBA, Jason had had a great career at Duke, 4 yrs, He was expected to do better then he did.

So were James Dean, Buddy Holly, the 1970 Marshall football team...

[grady41]

Ask the Bulls if they would of drafted another player if they could redraft the Jason Williams year. While your at it ask the Wiz if they would redraft Kwame Brown.

[Sports Guy]

Len Elmore has come up with his own "player rater index" and in his formula, Scheyer wins ACC POY...Delaney was second and Vazquez was third.

[Ruzious]

I guess you dont rememeber reading about how he wasnt getting it done? I do.

Now does this mean he would of been a bust had he not got hurt? No, but he did get hurt and was a bust.No one will know what he would of done.

Kobe was coming out if high school, wasnt ready for the NBA, Jason had had a great career at Duke, 4 yrs, He was expected to do better then he did.

I think he was at Duke for 3 years, but Jay or Jason or whatever he calls himself nowadays - was never going to be more than an average NBA PG. He hit his peak early. Notice he was pretty much the same player as a freshman as he was an NBA rookie. His limitations showed up in the NBA - he was a small PG who couldn't finish against NBA athletes - and finishing was a strength of his in college. All of a sudden, he had average tools compared to his competition. And I felt bad for the guy - How do you adjust to getting all the calls he got at Duke to getting the rookie treatment from NBA officials? I laugh, but it's true. Even honest Duke fans admit that.

[YardBirds13]

Len Elmore has come up with his own "player rater index" and in his formula, Scheyer wins ACC POY...Delaney was second and Vazquez was third.

Did you see how he comes up with it though? It's completely insane. He just randomly multiplies stats by random numbers (including team wins) to come up with the "rating index".

Scheyer has had a fantastic season. No question. I'd put him second on my ballot. But Vasquez is the ACC POY this year. And I don't think it's particularly close.

[Sports Guy]

I think he was at Duke for 3 years, but Jay or Jason or whatever he calls himself nowadays - was never going to be more than an average NBA PG. He hit his peak early. Notice he was pretty much the same player as a freshman as he was an NBA rookie. His limitations showed up in the NBA - he was a small PG who couldn't finish against NBA athletes - and finishing was a strength of his in college. All of a sudden, he had average tools compared to his competition. And I felt bad for the guy - How do you adjust to getting all the calls he got at Duke to getting the rookie treatment from NBA officials? I laugh, but it's true. Even honest Duke fans admit that.

A lot of this isn't true...His shooting % went up from his frosh year...His PPG went up a lot despite playing less minutes.

So yes, he did improve.

He was a 10-5(and his A/TO ratio was almost 2:1) guy in his rookie year, playing like 25 minutes a game...He would have been a very good NBA player...Perennial AS? Not sure but closing the book on it is absurd.

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/duke/22-jason-williams

[beaner]

A lot of this isn't true...His shooting % went up from his frosh year...His PPG went up a lot despite playing less minutes.

So yes, he did improve.

He was a 10-5(and his A/TO ratio was almost 2:1) guy in his rookie year, playing like 25 minutes a game...He would have been a very good NBA player...Perennial AS? Not sure but closing the book on it is absurd.

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/duke/22-jason-williams

He was a terrific College player, there's no doubt about that..I think he would have been a pretty good PG in the NBA..I didn't think he was a good shooter, but his percentages were better than I thought they were looking at the stats above..Good defensive guard too.

[Lucky Jim]

I think he was at Duke for 3 years, but Jay or Jason or whatever he calls himself nowadays - was never going to be more than an average NBA PG. He hit his peak early. Notice he was pretty much the same player as a freshman as he was an NBA rookie. His limitations showed up in the NBA - he was a small PG who couldn't finish against NBA athletes - and finishing was a strength of his in college. All of a sudden, he had average tools compared to his competition. And I felt bad for the guy - How do you adjust to getting all the calls he got at Duke to getting the rookie treatment from NBA officials? I laugh, but it's true. Even honest Duke fans admit that.

This was my criticism, too. I didn't think he'd be elite in the NBA because he couldn't play at or above the rim. He used his exceptional strength and good quickness to outmuscle college point guards and get into the lane, but he couldn't do that in the NBA. He was a good shooter - but a streaky one. He didn't have superior vision, either, so it's tough to imagine what kind of NBA player he would have been. Something like Joe Dumars, maybe?

[grady41]

All 3 deserve POY votes, Scheyer,Delaney and Vas. Along with Booker , that guy is solid.

How it will shake out is will Singlar take votes from Scheyler. How do the Terps and VT and Clemson finish and does the NC vote ignor Booker and Vas.

All 4 in there own way deserve to vote.

Now for facial expressions Scheyer wins hands down!

[Ruzious]

A lot of this isn't true...His shooting % went up from his frosh year...His PPG went up a lot despite playing less minutes.

So yes, he did improve.

He was a 10-5(and his A/TO ratio was almost 2:1) guy in his rookie year, playing like 25 minutes a game...He would have been a very good NBA player...Perennial AS? Not sure but closing the book on it is absurd.

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/duke/22-jason-williams

He improved his scoring but his assists and rebounds went down. He pretty much was what he was going to be - at least by the end of his frosh year. All of his stats were worse in his junior year than in his sophomore year. Again, he peaked early, and he just didn't have the talent to be anything special in the NBA. He had the proverbial limited upside. If everything went well, maybe he could have developed into an okay starter. And say what you will - he did not... have a good rookie year. An almost 2/1 A/TO ratio is bad for an NBA PG. His shooting percentages stunk. And he was a limited defensive player.

[Sports Guy]

He improved his scoring but his assists and rebounds went down. He pretty much was what he was going to be - at least by the end of his frosh year. All of his stats were worse in his junior year than in his sophomore year. Again, he peaked early, and he just didn't have the talent to be anything special in the NBA. He had the proverbial limited upside. If everything went well, maybe he could have developed into an okay starter. And say what you will - he did not... have a good rookie year. An almost 2/1 A/TO ratio is bad for an NBA PG. His shooting percentages stunk. And he was a limited defensive player.

1) His shooting was better in second and third year than first year..That's an improvement.

2) His assists went down as his scoring was more needed...Should be obvious.

3) 2:1 as a rookie is fine.

Saying he had limited upside is just poor on every level.

He wasn't a great shooter, I agree with that...But he was a great scorer...Kind of like Iverson and Arenas(not comparing them persay just talking about their scoring abilities).

[Pedro Cerrano]

1) His shooting was better in second and third year than first year..That's an improvement.

2) His assists went down as his scoring was more needed...Should be obvious.

3) 2:1 as a rookie is fine.

Saying he had limited upside is just poor on every level.

He wasn't a great shooter, I agree with that...But he was a great scorer...Kind of like Iverson and Arenas(not comparing them persay just talking about their scoring abilities).

On what planet is Allen Iverson not a good shooter?

[BaltimoreTerp]

On what planet is Allen Iverson not a good shooter?

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/i/iversal01.html

The one where he shoots 42% from the field and 31% from three.

[BaltimoreTerp]

Len Elmore has come up with his own "player rater index" and in his formula, Scheyer wins ACC POY...Delaney was second and Vazquez was third.

Who's he? Some kind of Duke lovin', Terp hatin' fool?

[Sports Guy]

On what planet is Allen Iverson not a good shooter?

Earth........