The Orioles, the media and the Hangout

[JackO]

Peace, I understand the money thing and I also know that the Orioles will play hardball with someone like the OH. On the other hand, the can't really bite the hand of the Baltimore Sun, especially in the condition they are in. The Orioles franchise looks at a place like the OH and other internet sites as an irritant, they worry about their relationship with the Sun.

Again. A misunderstanding, Clarence. Sites like the Hangout are important for the Orioles. It's a great place to sell tickets to games and merchandise. Or have you not noticed the advertisements on this site selling Orioles' tickets and merchandise? The O's are not buying those ads as a handout to Tony to be nice. They see a value in the advertisements or else they would not spend the money.

[Birds of B'more]

Peace, I understand the money thing and I also know that the Orioles will play hardball with someone like the OH. On the other hand, the can't really bite the hand of the Baltimore Sun, especially in the condition they are in. The Orioles franchise looks at a place like the OH and other internet sites as an irritant, they worry about their relationship with the Sun.

Is that why they offer members here a discount on tickets for Hangout Nights???

[JackO]

Is that why they offer members here a discount on tickets for Hangout Nights???

Or is it why this page exists?

http://baltimore.orioles.mlb.com/ticketing/index.jsp?c_id=bal

[SilentJames]

Moreover, people are probably more willing to talk to Tony than say the Sun. Tony has connections and people that share a mutual feeling of trust.

Some people might just feel more comfotable talking to Tony than they would talking to Schmuck or Roch.

Either way the story will get out there and we shall all see what is going on.

[Sports Guy]

Judging by what I was told by a member of the media yesterday, its not so easy to write these stories up.

Tony isn't going to lie but Tony also isn't held to the same standard the Sun is.

Tony will write his article with the proper discretion but still, its a little different than a guy like Roch or Jeff Z.

[clarence]

JackO, I'm just going to agree to disagree with you. I had lunch today with the owner of an arena football team, we were discussing how the message boards get things riled up. Yes, a very small percentage of fans visit these sites, but a majority of the posts (and complaints) come from an even smaller number. Yet, rumors get started and front offices have new things to deal with. If Tony stirs something up, the Sun is almost obligated to do a little research. The Orioles don't want this.

Again, we disagree. Fine. You are a journalist, I spent too much time dealing with journalists in my past career. We see things differently.

[SilentJames]

Judging by what I was told by a member of the media yesterday, its not so easy to write these stories up.

Tony isn't going to lie but Tony also isn't held to the same standard the Sun is.

Tony will write his article with the proper discretion but still, its a little different than a guy like Roch or Jeff Z.

Exactly. In situations like this if sources are wrong, or the simplest mistakes are made then your entire career could be over.

[JackO]

JackO, I'm just going to agree to disagree with you. I had lunch today with the owner of an arena football team, we were discussing how the message boards get things riled up. Yes, a very small percentage of fans visit these sites, but a majority of the posts (and complaints) come from an even smaller number. Yet, rumors get started and front offices have new things to deal with. If Tony stirs something up, the Sun is almost obligated to do a little research. The Orioles don't want this.

Again, we disagree. Fine. You are a journalist, I spent too much time dealing with journalists in my past career. We see things differently.

Yeah... it seems that you have an ax to grind with journalists. What exactly was your role with journalists in your past career? Not asking for whom you worked. Just the job title.

[JTrea81]

Exactly. In situations like this if sources are wrong, or the simplest mistakes are made then your entire career could be over.

Well we all saw what happened to Rosenthal about the Ripken-Angelos-MacPhail triangle...

[clarence]

I guess another way to phrase much of this would be, why is the Sun so afraid to ask McPhail and Angelos the really tough questions?

I would think the trendy thing right now among the Suns readership is to bash the O's. The Sun could easily add even more fuel to the fire by not letting Andy and PA off the hook so easily. It would make for some great reading. Again, no wonder newspapers are dying.

(and the reason the O's offer a discount to the OH on Hangout Nights is because they are getting a "group discount". They don't care if the kkk shows up, if the numbers are right, some sales rep is going to discount their seats.)

[TiredofLosing20]

This is a double edged sword sometimes though. Because getting close sometimes means not burning bridges. And if you want to protect your job and yourself long term it can be difficult to gain some of this information.

Sometimes I don't think it's so cut and dry when it comes to investigative reporting. I for one am happy about all the sources I see, the more the better. And even if some of them are connected to the Sun I still think the more people that are talking and the more information that's out there the better off we are.

The OP seems to me to need to get off his high horse while he's busy accusing everyone of not doing their jobs then, and make sure he's filling in the gaps. It always seems easy to criticize, especially the media or decisions so magnified by the media. But sometimes when it comes time to do something it's not as easy as just sounding off on people and saying they aren't doing their jobs.

I think you are right on target here... It is easy to criticize journalists for not asking the tough questions but when your success and livelihood is dependent on the people you are asking the questions it can be a fine line to walk.

[wickedwitch]

I just wonder why the journalists aren't noticing the same things that we notice. The lack of scouts has been brought up before. Why not ask MacPhail about it? The poor minor league development of hitting prospects has been brought up here. And somehow we never hear about anybody criticizing Crowley, just people defending him. Yet the HBT noticed a bad pattern, and they don't even cover the Orioles specifically.

[SilentJames]

Well we all saw what happened to Rosenthal about the Ripken-Angelos-MacPhail triangle...

Yes, this is what happens when you run with complete conjecture and the people surrounding it won't back you up at all.

[Birds of B'more]

I guess another way to phrase much of this would be, why is the Sun so afraid to ask McPhail and Angelos the really tough questions?

I would think the trendy thing right now among the Suns readership is to bash the O's. The Sun could easily add even more fuel to the fire by not letting Andy and PA off the hook so easily. It would make for some great reading. Again, no wonder newspapers are dying.

(and the reason the O's offer a discount to the OH on Hangout Nights is because they are getting a "group discount". They don't care if the kkk shows up, if the numbers are right, some sales rep is going to discount their seats.)

Newspapers are dying because they don't generate enough revenue in advertisements to sustain their operations anymore. I haven't seen a print edition of The Sun in years, but I see tons of banner ads on their website from the O's, which I'm sure wasn't free. In other words, when food is scarce, you don't bite the hand that feeds you.

[Tony-OH]

I am sure that Tony's story, whenever it comes out, will be highly entertaining. But, like most of the "insider information" that we get on here, I am sure it will also be full of holes and speculation.

Parts of whatever he writes I am sure will be spot on and accurate, but it will not go through the same vetting process that anyone who writes for the Sun or any credible news outlet has to endure to make sure that the entirety of the story is accurate.

In the real news world, speculation and rumors are treated as speculation and rumors that must be verified before they are reported as fact. Here on the Hangout -- and in the general world of amateur news -- speculation and rumor play very important roles. They generate conversation among the several hundred of us who visit this site regularly because we want to do just that -- talk about the Orioles.

I can assure you that if there is really a story to whatever Tony will report then The Sun is already on it, especially because there has been no secret here that Tony is working on something that involves dysfunction and unrest in the front office. And any decent professional journalist would be damned if he was scooped by an amateur news site, especially when that amateur news site has tipped its hand.

Still, like the rest of us, i am still looking forward to whatever Tony has to write.

But, hey, I am sure that there is some amateur that can do whatever job it is that you do better than you do it for free.

signed --

working journalist.

I just talked to Scott today about all of this and I told him these kind of attacks would start. I'm not going to go into why the sources have come out to me, but considering I get paid to write this stuff and the site is credentialed just like the Sun, calling us an amateur news site tells a lot more about your motives here than anything else.