CBSSports: Hardy & Harris for Hoey & Jacobson a done deal

[Babypowder]

I think we need to have a bit of perspective.

MacPhail did two excellent trades in relation to what we received.

Reynolds against weaker pitching hits tons of homers and strikes out a million times. I think we won the trade but he's not a game changer for us.

We got Hardy for nothing. This is great. He could be brittle and a modest performer and still be an upgrade over Izzy.

But we didn't just change the AL East dynamics here.

The Red Sox got massively better. Sure they lost Beltre and VMart but they went and got two players that are much better than both of them.

You think the Yankees will now let Cliff Lee go anywhere else. Just adding him is a better offseason than we'll have.

So MacPhail pulled off two winning trades and the team got better. But these weren't leaps and bounds. We need that. We won 66 games last year.

Derrek Lee isn't doing that for us. Prince Fielder does.

We get him plus extension for a Britton led package and this is an offseason where we have a shot at making waves in the actual season.

I'm not sure he was facing weaker pitching. The rotations in the NL West are pretty stacked.

Who expected us to change the AL East dynamics this offseason? How would you have proposed we do it in a reasonable fashion? (i.e. something not involving signing every free agent available)

Fielder doesn't make us a contender this year. Trading Britton for him for one year is silly and we all know we aren't paying him what it would take anyway. Nor should we, we would need to offer him silly money to get him to skip free agency. I don't even want to see what Fielder is going to look like in his 30s. Guys who look like him rarely get smaller as they age.

I agree with your basic premises, we need to do a lot better in the amateur game and internationally if we are going to turn this ship around. We can't tread water forever and if we want to be a good franchise again we have to be the cutting edge somewhere. That somewhere isn't going to be free agency though. This is going to be a team almost completely built from within with a smattering of shrewd trades and the occasional free agent. That's just the way it is. Will it take us to a division title? Not unless we get a whole lot better at doing it, but I think we can all be at least a little happy about being a better team now than we were last year.

[Mark Carver]

By the way, did anyone read the first few comments in the comments section? Wow, what a bunch of uneducated Orioles fans. Apparently those are the ones that hang out in the comments sections at CBSSports.

Like......

Mark Reynolds, now JJ Hardy? I'd rather watch rookies struggle through the year than watch these guys. Give Josh Bell and Robert Andino a chance to play every day. So sick of the Orioles doing this year after year, after year.

[BrunoCherrytown]

A one year bump? All you are hoping for is league avg production from Reynolds, Hardy, and Lee/LaRoche. The development of this team is going to come from within.

Only Markakis is 27 of the younger core... their development/maturation and increased production as they reach their respective primes should continue.

My point is our system isnt made to develop from within we don't have the 'build from within' resources that our AL East competitors do.

We are hoping for our core like Wieters, Jones, Tillman, Matusz, Briton, etc to develop and that's what the Blue Jays and Rays are doing too.

But they are built to continuously recharge and replace their core because of the resources they commit to those parts of the game.

We have a current core and then a weak farm system because we only had enough core for one big surge.

Like the pace horse at the Belmont each year. And that horse never wins cause it's not built for the long run.

[REDMAN]

I'm not sure he was facing weaker pitching. The rotations in the NL West are pretty stacked.

Who expected us to change the AL East dynamics this offseason? How would you have proposed we do it in a reasonable fashion? (i.e. something not involving signing every free agent available)

Fielder doesn't make us a contender this year. Trading Britton for him for one year is silly and we all know we aren't paying him what it would take anyway. Nor should we, we would need to offer him silly money to get him to skip free agency. I don't even want to see what Fielder is going to look like in his 30s. Guys who look like him rarely get smaller as they age.

I agree with your basic premises, we need to do a lot better in the amateur game and internationally if we are going to turn this ship around. We can't tread water forever and if we want to be a good franchise again we have to be the cutting edge somewhere. That somewhere isn't going to be free agency though. This is going to be a team almost completely built from within with a smattering of shrewd trades and the occasional free agent. That's just the way it is. Will it take us to a division title? Not unless we get a whole lot better at doing it, but I think we can all be at least a little happy about being a better team now than we were last year.

With Boston lineup being predominately lefty,Britton become a very,very,inportant part of the future!In fact the orioles should get another lefthander!

[BrunoCherrytown]

I'm not sure he was facing weaker pitching. The rotations in the NL West are pretty stacked.

Who expected us to change the AL East dynamics this offseason? How would you have proposed we do it in a reasonable fashion? (i.e. something not involving signing every free agent available)

Fielder doesn't make us a contender this year. Trading Britton for him for one year is silly and we all know we aren't paying him what it would take anyway. Nor should we, we would need to offer him silly money to get him to skip free agency. I don't even want to see what Fielder is going to look like in his 30s. Guys who look like him rarely get smaller as they age.

I agree with your basic premises, we need to do a lot better in the amateur game and internationally if we are going to turn this ship around. We can't tread water forever and if we want to be a good franchise again we have to be the cutting edge somewhere. That somewhere isn't going to be free agency though. This is going to be a team almost completely built from within with a smattering of shrewd trades and the occasional free agent. That's just the way it is. Will it take us to a division title? Not unless we get a whole lot better at doing it, but I think we can all be at least a little happy about being a better team now than we were last year.

I'm going to say I jumped the gun on that weaker pitching statement. I thought about this after you and another poster called me out on that.

They do have some great pitching over there.

[Goop]

I try not to get myself too involved in the off-season shenanigans, because quite frankly you never know how any of these moves turn out until the season starts. That being said, I am happy with the moves so far. I'm pissed about what the Sox have done because the rich just keep getting richer, but AM has gotten a lot of holes filled for us with the best available talent.

[Tony-OH]

This is why you don't trade Nolan Reimold for Jason Bartlett. Great trade.

Well, you are absolutely right. The idea of making that trade was if Hardy's asking price was too high. If this was Hardy's asking price, than the Reimold discussion never needed to happen.

I just wonder what changed? Either way, I prefer this trade 100 times out of 100 over the Reimold for Bartlett so yes, it's a good thing that didn't happen.

[waroriole]

My point is our system isnt made to develop from within we don't have the 'build from within' resources that our AL East competitors do.

We are hoping for our core like Wieters, Jones, Tillman, Matusz, Briton, etc to develop and that's what the Blue Jays and Rays are doing too.

But they are built to continuously recharge and replace their core because of the resources they commit to those parts of the game.

We have a current core and then a weak farm system because we only had enough core for one big surge.

Like the pace horse at the Belmont each year. And that horse never wins cause it's not built for the long run.

I agree completely about how we lack on drafting and international FA. What I don't understand is why you are using this thread as your soapbox for this.

Though, I will say that we took a big chance in the '09 draft on some injured arms that we paid overslot money to. Most didn't show much (if anything) last year, but are still in our system, and can still develop into depth for our MiL system. I think our system looks alot different this time next year.

[Tony-OH]

I think we need to have a bit of perspective.

MacPhail did two excellent trades in relation to what we received.

Reynolds against weaker pitching hits tons of homers and strikes out a million times. I think we won the trade but he's not a game changer for us.

We got Hardy for nothing. This is great. He could be brittle and a modest performer and still be an upgrade over Izzy.

But we didn't just change the AL East dynamics here.

The Red Sox got massively better. Sure they lost Beltre and VMart but they went and got two players that are much better than both of them.

You think the Yankees will now let Cliff Lee go anywhere else. Just adding him is a better offseason than we'll have.

So MacPhail pulled off two winning trades and the team got better. But these weren't leaps and bounds. We need that. We won 66 games last year.

Derrek Lee isn't doing that for us. Prince Fielder does.

We get him plus extension for a Britton led package and this is an offseason where we have a shot at making waves in the actual season.

I understand your sentiments here, but no way do you trade Britton for one-year of Fielder. That's ludicrous.

MacPhail traded for two players in their prime who have the potential to get better for what amounted to one major league reliever, two C-Type minor league relief prospects and a D-level minor league relief prospect (Jacobson).

I've had my concerns about MacPhail, but I can't find one thing to fault him on so far this offseason. He now needs to acquire a power hitting first baseman and his offseason will be a success.

[Brendan25]

According to Brittany Ghiroli of MLB.com, the Orioles trade for J.J. Hardy won't be official until after Thursday's Rule 5 Draft.

The O's are set to acquire Hardy and Brendan Harris from the Twins, but but Ghiroli hears that Baltimore's No. 4 pick in the Rule 5 Draft could be involved in the deal. The Twins are also expected to receive prospect pitchers Brett Jacobson and Jim Hoey.

Source: rotoworld

Lets just hope that this doesn't fall through.

[Sports Guy]

We added around 8.5-9 million on our payroll...there is your reason this trade is done.

That and Jacobson has some upside of being a ML reliever.

So, the Twins saved a little extra money to be able to sign Nishioki and a reliever or 2.

The Twins aren't stupid...They made this trade for a reason.

[TGO]

Well, you are absolutely right. The idea of making that trade was if Hardy's asking price was too high. If this was Hardy's asking price, than the Reimold discussion never needed to happen.

I just wonder what changed? Either way, I prefer this trade 100 times out of 100 over the Reimold for Bartlett so yes, it's a good thing that didn't happen.

I think as TB and Minnesota got closer to having to offer contract numbers to the two guys they started feeling the pressure a little more. After AM walked and TB caved with a really horrendous deal sending Bartlett to SD, the Twins didn't have much leverage. Yes, Pittsburgh was nominally involved, but I don't think they were serious. They don't have much payroll room. Taking Harris also helps because he was completely unneeded and gives them an extra buck 75 to play with.

[waroriole]

Lets just hope that this doesn't fall through.

That sucks. I was hoping we wouldn't have to give up our Rule 5 pick.

[Tony-OH]

I agree with all the sentiments expressed....these are very nice deals that give Buck a stronger team certainly to manage....still.....there is the small matter of being in the AL East....this week we obtain Mark Reynolds and JJ Hardy and the Red Sox get Adrian Gonzalez and Carl Crawford.....whew...it is going to always be hard and we may never see the Orioles win in this division without some type of parity arrangement.

Here's the thing, we can't always focus on what the Red Sox and Yankees are doing because honestly it will just lead to depression. All we can do is look at our team and see that its better than it was at the end of last season. We're one power hitting first baseman away from having a realistically great off season.

[Phantom]

I love waking up to good news. I think Hardy has a legit shot to hit 20 bombs, and a 110% chance to be a huge improvement over what we had last year.