O's future is based on pitching prospects

[Sports Guy]

18 hours ago, SteveA said:

45 of the Astros 73 starts this year have been made by guys who were international signings while Elias was there (Urquiddy, Garcia, Valdez, Javier).  

An additional 11 starts were made by Lance McCullers, who was drafted when Elias was there.

One game was started by Tyler Ivey, who was drafted when Elias was there.

To acquire Zach Greinke in 2019, the Astros traded Seth Beers (drafted while Elias was there), JB Bukauskus (drafted while Elias was there), Corbin Martin (drafted while Elias was there), and Josh Rojas (drafted while Elias was there).   Greinke has started 16 games.

So 65 of the 73 Astros starts this year were made by guys who were acquired and developed by the team when Elias was there, or who was acquired in trade with assets who were acquired and devloped by the team when Elias was there.

They have only "bought" 8 starts so far this year -- Jake Odorizzi, who they signed as a free agent in March.

And they are in first place, with the best record in the American League and second best in baseball.

So yeah, they did do a lot of "buying the arms" to get their first WS team.   But now they have the second best record in baseball with a pitching staff that is a product of their system.   And yes, that includes Greinke.   If you trade two guys you drafted in the first round and one you drafted in the 2nd to get a guy -- he is essentially the fruits of your drafting.

I'd say that bodes well for us, but we will; have to wait a few years until our international signees start turning into Javier/Urquiddy/Valdez/Garcia, since we were late to that game.

Yes, I went over all of this earlier in the thread.  
 

The point remains the same..there are a lot of ways to build a team and saying our future depends on the arms we have is wrong.  Our future depends on the team being smart and making the proper moves and developing players well.

[Ruzious]

It definitely helps to have 3 or 4 STUD young pitchers to build around (See Atlanta Braves 1991-2005, Maddux/Smoltz/Glavine/Avery and mostly just solid everyday lineups winning 14 straight division championships), but like SG said, there a lot of ways to build a winner.  The old Cincinatti Reds teams with Rose, Bench, Morgan, etc didn't have much pitching for the most part.  Get the best talents regardless of position, develop them well, balance the roster with smart trades and free agents, and you should do well.

[orioles22]

On 6/22/2021 at 6:07 PM, Philip said:

All I know is that I want to see the pitching prospects. All the malarkey from guys who cover the team who say that there’s no replacement for Harvey is just as ridiculous as it can be. There is no reason not to call up the guys, one at a time, in order of availability, And throw them into the fray.

We don’t have any elite prospects on the cusp, so service time considerations are irrelevant. But we do need to know what to do with the crush we’re going to have on the 40 man, and no better time to find out then now.

Rushing them to Baltimore in a lost season doesn't seem like a smart move to me. I think Elias will make sure to check all the boxes before they get to the majors, and I hope he does. I hate to see prospects start shuttling back and forth because they were moved up too quickly.

[Philip]

16 minutes ago, orioles22 said:

Rushing them to Baltimore in a lost season doesn't seem like a smart move to me. I think Elias will make sure to check all the boxes before they get to the majors, and I hope he does. I hate to see prospects start shuttling back and forth because they were moved up too quickly.

I appreciate that but I’m not suggesting rushing anyone. I’m suggesting bringing up guys who have mastered their level. The only way to learn to deal the MLB is to play MLB. We’ve seen countless times, guys who were great at AAA and mediocre or worse at the big level, and it’s best to find out now, especially for the second tier guys who need to show they deserve a spot on the 40-man ahead of the Rule 5.

Lowther being shuffled back and forth is inexplicable, as has been mentioned here more than once. There’s no reason for it, but there’s also neither need nor reason to bring a guy up and then send him back down. Give him a meaningful audition

[orioles22]

That's true about AAA pitchers not making it in the majors, but then again I can't think of very many who were great at the AAA level for the Orioles the last 25 years.

The thing is if we did bring Hall and Rodriguez and they struggled, I don't think we'd leave them unprotected. They would get several chances. I'd rather let them dominate AA for a while, then do the same at AAA and not have anything left to prove on either level.

[orioles22]

I just noticed you did say second-tier guys, so that doesn't mean Hall and Rodriguez. I wouldn't rush them either. I don't think it was a good idea to skip Lowther past AAA.

[Jagwar]

On 6/22/2021 at 4:43 PM, Sports Guy said:

No it’s not.  
 

How many pitching prospects propelled the Astros to a WS win?

I was under the impression it was a really good trash can

[Gentile4]

It will be interesting to watch what they do with Hall and Rodriguez since neither pitched in 2020. I'll be surprised if either goes over 100 innings this year, especially with Hall on the IL. Should they give both a taste of AAA at the end of this season if they continue to excel in AA? I couldn't hurt, but if Bowie is in the playoffs, it would probably be better to let them stay there to gain experience in higher leverage situations. 

[Can_of_corn]

29 minutes ago, Gentile4 said:

It will be interesting to watch what they do with Hall and Rodriguez since neither pitched in 2020. I'll be surprised if either goes over 100 innings this year, especially with Hall on the IL. Should they give both a taste of AAA at the end of this season if they continue to excel in AA? I couldn't hurt, but if Bowie is in the playoffs, it would probably be better to let them stay there to gain experience in higher leverage situations. 

No playoffs in the minors.

[Gentile4]

I keep forgetting about that. 

[7Mo]

9 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

No playoffs in the minors.

Yet another conspiracy to prevent Elias from developing players.

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, 7Mo said:

Yet another conspiracy to prevent Elias from developing players.

What is even worse all the other teams get to have playoffs.

[7Mo]

6 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

What is even worse all the other teams get to have playoffs.

First the pandemic, now this playoff conspiracy. And to top it off, just imagine where this rebuild could be with a healthy Chris Davis producing like ownership knows he can.

[OriolesMagic83]

1 hour ago, 7Mo said:

First the pandemic, now this playoff conspiracy. And to top it off, just imagine where this rebuild could be with a healthy Chris Davis producing like ownership knows he can.

Davis has been helping the team tank since 2018 and gets no credit.  What a team player!

[Explosivo]

One thing that seems to already be improving the team as a whole are the international prospects. We are getting great news about all of them and their projections are looking to be hitting the mark. Hell we even are getting great news about Mayo. I’m hearing he’ll be a future middle of the order bat and there is talk of him having the most power of any bat from the 2020 draft class. My point is our scouts are picking the right guys and all these fellas are going to blossom at the same time. You can call up a guy like Mayo to be your DH, you can call up a guy like Henderson and Westburg early when you have a near complete team already. The outfield will be set. The pitching and catching talent is there and near ready. We will keep injecting these young guys in the mix and will win it all with these young cats.