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Jorge Mateo 2024

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, Ceciltrav said:

You think Mateo can play 3rd base as well?  If so, no reason to have Urias at that point?

He probably could play third but I don’t think they have ever tried him there. We don’t even hear about him taking grounders at third.

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Sports Guy
Sports Guy

People get so upset over jokes nowadays.  Get over it. 

Roy Firestone
Roy Firestone

That on deck swing that Mullins hit Mateo with... was probably Mullins best contact with a bat  on the day.

Can_of_corn
Can_of_corn

He certainly made the 8th inning more exciting.

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Safelykept Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

Safelykept

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4 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

He probably could play third but I don’t think they have ever tried him there. We don’t even hear about him taking grounders at third.

 

4 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

He probably could play third but I don’t think they have ever tried him there. We don’t even hear about him taking grounders at third.

Has not played 3rd since 2021. Didn't look it up but seemed only a couple games Dont know how many with SD

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Tony-OH Hangout Grand Counsel

Tony-OH

Posted
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8 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

He probably could play third but I don’t think they have ever tried him there. We don’t even hear about him taking grounders at third.

Not a lot of guys want to play 3B so that's why it's rare to see guys like Mateo play over there. It's such a reactionary position that it's really quite different from SS and 2B. 

I think most organizations think it's unfair to ask a guy to play there without a lot of experience. Could he emergency fill in there, sure, but his lack of 3B experience suggests he would only play there in an emergency and I honestly think if it were to finish off a game, they'd play Gunnar for a few innings at 3B rather than Mateo, and allow Mateo to play SS.

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HelenaEngineer Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

HelenaEngineer

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Posted
2 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

They get so enamored by his defense and speed that the black hole he is as a hitter just gets overlooked.

I haven't seen that much defense to be enamored with since 2022, when he was exceptional at SS. The metrics show him as average at best at 2B, which aligns fairly well with my eye test. He is basically going to hit .220 with an OBP of .267 (last 3 years .267, .267. .266 so I will give him consistency). He is a bit better vs LHP, but even there is he has a .301 OBP and .782 OPS this year which isn't exactly world beating.

Dating to June 1, he is hitting .191 with an OBP of .211 and OPS of .535 while playing average defense. There is not necessarily a huge rush, and the best two options are dependent on the replacement being ready, but by September, something has to change. It is a pretty safe bet Mateo's performance won't be the thing that changes given his long track record - so one of these three needs to take place before the post-season:

1. Holliday gets healthy, gets in a groove and at a minimum platoons at 2B with Mateo giving the Orioles a boost vs RHP and frankly, probably on defense as well. That probably means Urias is gone and Mateo gets platoon / PR role

2. Mayo comes up and takes over 3B with Westburg moving to 2B. You take a hit on defense at 3B but probably break even at 2B. Vs lefties, you can DH Mayo and use Mateo at 2B and Westburg at 3B which probably takes ABs away from some combination of McCann and Kjerstad/Cowser/Mullins to improve platoon splits. That also likely means Urias is gone.

3. You shift more ABs over time from Mateo to Urias as long at Mateo is in a funk and if Mateo gets in one of his 3-4 week hot streaks you ride it. You are stuck with below average offense and average defense in this case, but dating back to June 1, Urias has an OBP edge of .337 to .211 and an OPS edge of .735 to .535 - so he at least approaches being playable offensively.

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Aristotelian Hangout Grand Counsel

Aristotelian

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6 minutes ago, HelenaEngineer said:

 It is a pretty safe bet Mateo's performance won't be the thing that changes given his long track record - so one of these three needs to take place before the post-season:

1. Holliday gets healthy, gets in a groove and at a minimum platoons at 2B with Mateo giving the Orioles a boost vs RHP and frankly, probably on defense as well. That probably means Urias is gone and Mateo gets platoon / PR role

2. Mayo comes up and takes over 3B with Westburg moving to 2B. You take a hit on defense at 3B but probably break even at 2B. Vs lefties, you can DH Mayo and use Mateo at 2B and Westburg at 3B which probably takes ABs away from some combination of McCann and Kjerstad/Cowser/Mullins to improve platoon splits. That also likely means Urias is gone.

3. You shift more ABs over time from Mateo to Urias as long at Mateo is in a funk and if Mateo gets in one of his 3-4 week hot streaks you ride it. You are stuck with below average offense and average defense in this case, but dating back to June 1, Urias has an OBP edge of .337 to .211 and an OPS edge of .735 to .535 - so he at least approaches being playable offensively.

Feels like they just don't like Mayo at 3B for now, otherwise he would be up by now. Seems like the short term fix is #3, with Urias playing 3B at least vs RHP, limiting Mateo to 2B vs LHP (maybe even cut back a bit on his LHP AB's). Keep giving them both opportunities to see if one of them can get hot, but maybe start favoring Urias. 

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HelenaEngineer Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

HelenaEngineer

Posted
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40 minutes ago, Allan Bryant said:

I thought Westberg is our full time 3rd baseman ?   Everyone talks about Urias is the 3rd baseman.  Mayo is going replace Urias at 3rd base ?   Did Westberg became a ghost 👻 ?  lol 

The topic of the thread is Jorge Mateo. When he (or Holliday in the future) is not in the lineup at 2B, then Westburg generally goes there. If you are playing either Urias or Mayo in the infield, then they go to 3rd for the most part and Westburg goes to 2B. No one is questioning that Westburg will be on the field at either 2B or 3B on an everyday basis.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

Posted
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2 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

Mateo is playing this much due to Holliday not being on the team. It has nothing to do with the Orioles loving Mateo. You could certainly play Urias more over him here and there. 

Of course it has to do with them loving Mateo because you could and should play Urias a lot more.

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eddie83 Hangout Grand Counsel

eddie83

Posted
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2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Of course it has to do with them loving Mateo because you could and should play Urias a lot more.

So the guy in Urias people want off the team needs to play more?

Mateo didn’t start 3 straight games, the last 2 in OAK and game 1 vs Cubs.  

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Allan Bryant Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

Allan Bryant

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14 minutes ago, HelenaEngineer said:

The topic of the thread is Jorge Mateo. When he (or Holliday in the future) is not in the lineup at 2B, then Westburg generally goes there. If you are playing either Urias or Mayo in the infield, then they go to 3rd for the most part and Westburg goes to 2B. No one is questioning that Westburg will be on the field at either 2B or 3B on an everyday basis.

Now that makes sense, thank you 

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Pickles Hangout Grand Counsel

Pickles

Posted
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2 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

So the guy in Urias people want off the team needs to play more?

Mateo didn’t start 3 straight games, the last 2 in OAK and game 1 vs Cubs.  

He's also got 40 more PAs than Urias on the year and has almost double his rWAR.

The idea that Urias is rotting on the bench and Mateo is playing every day is a false narrative set up by people who live to complain.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

So the guy in Urias people want off the team needs to play more?

Mateo didn’t start 3 straight games, the last 2 in OAK and game 1 vs Cubs.  

I have said for the last 6ish weeks that Urias needed to play more.

There are a lot of people I would like off the team.  Urias isn’t someone I want off but he’s expendable…but he’s better than Mateo and should play more than him.(at least in a role of semi regular..Mateo is the better role player/bench piece)

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eddie83 Hangout Grand Counsel

eddie83

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Just now, Sports Guy said:

I have said for the last 6ish weeks that Urias needed to play more.

There are a lot of people I would like off the team.  Urias isn’t someone I want off but he’s expendable…but he’s better than Mateo and should play more than him.

We know they like to start Mateo vs LHP. I think it’s more of a question about Urias when Mateo starts vs RHP.  
 

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Pickles Hangout Grand Counsel

Pickles

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I have said for the last 6ish weeks that Urias needed to play more.

There are a lot of people I would like off the team.  Urias isn’t someone I want off but he’s expendable…but he’s better than Mateo and should play more than him.(at least in a role of semi regular..Mateo is the better role player/bench piece)

If Urias is better than Mateo, why does Mateo double him in rWAR and triple him in fWAR?

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