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Keith Law takes another shot at the O's

ChaosLex

By ChaosLex
in Orioles Talk

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Flosman Major Leaguer

Flosman

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Listen. It's very simple. Until our Front office and scouts prove that they are as smart as other teams FO and scouts we (the Orioles and their supporters) are going to have to put up with this stuff. The onus is on the O's to prove that Law is wrong not the other way around. We should find out the answer on Wada and the major league players this season. We might not find out the answer on this Korean pitcher for a couple of years. Of course, no matter how much credit I want to concede to Law, you'd have to believe only an idiot would give 550K to a kid who throws 80mph with no secondaries. Even for the O's, that's hard to fathom.

I really think over the past 14 years we have done things this dumb. I hoped we were moving in the right direction and that is why I am interested in what the truth is.

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LookinUp Hangout Grand Counsel

LookinUp

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Listen. It's very simple. Until our Front office and scouts prove that they are as smart as other teams FO and scouts we (the Orioles and their supporters) are going to have to put up with this stuff. The onus is on the O's to prove that Law is wrong not the other way around. We should find out the answer on Wada and the major league players this season. We might not find out the answer on this Korean pitcher for a couple of years. Of course, no matter how much credit I want to concede to Law, you'd have to believe only an idiot would give 550K to a kid who throws 80mph with no secondaries. Even for the O's, that's hard to fathom.

Post of the thread, IMO.

It's possible that Law was friends with Flanagan, or some of our scouts who were fired/reassigned, or hated DD from the old days (we know he was basically blackballed from baseball for 10 years), or is privy to ugly details from our botched GM search, or he just has a long history of seeing the O's as a terrible organization, and thus is biased. This is all possible.

However, it's also possible that he's actually familiar with what DD has done since he came in and strongly disapproves. Maybe he sees DD trading for Teagarden and Eveland as a total waste. Maybe he sees us sinking too much money internationally for the value we're getting. Maybe he thinks what we're doing with scouting makes no sense. Stotle is one of the most respected posters on this site and he seems less than enamored with what DD has done so far.

In a nutshell, when connected people are skeptical about what's happening here, I think it's at least fair for unconnected people to take pause. I like that DD is going international, hasn't spent on another Gregg or Vlad or Lee and has replaced a bunch of staff. What I don't know, and won't until they build their own track record, is whether the new organization will be any more likely to succeed. I don't know the details and I don't have direct experience identifying what does and doesn't work. In the absence of evidence, the last thing I'm going to do is totally discount the opinion of people who hear things from industry insiders.

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Lucky Jim Hangout Grand Counsel

Lucky Jim

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Post of the thread, IMO.

It's possible that Law was friends with Flanagan, or some of our scouts who were fired/reassigned, or hated DD from the old days (we know he was basically blackballed from baseball for 10 years), or is privy to ugly details from our botched GM search, or he just has a long history of seeing the O's as a terrible organization, and thus is biased. This is all possible.

However, it's also possible that he's actually familiar with what DD has done since he came in and strongly disapproves. Maybe he sees DD trading for Teagarden and Eveland as a total waste. Maybe he sees us sinking too much money internationally for the value we're getting. Maybe he thinks what we're doing with scouting makes no sense. Stotle is one of the most respected posters on this site and he seems less than enamored with what DD has done so far.

In a nutshell, when connected people are skeptical about what's happening here, I think it's at least fair for unconnected people to take pause. I like that DD is going international, hasn't spent on another Gregg or Vlad or Lee and has replaced a bunch of staff. What I don't know, and won't until they build their own track record, is whether the new organization will be any more likely to succeed. I don't know the details and I don't have direct experience identifying what does and doesn't work. In the absence of evidence, the last thing I'm going to do is totally discount the opinion of people who hear things from industry insiders.

Is it the post of the thread if you subtract the last two sentences (that you seem to contradict)?

BTW, I don't really disagree with you here. He may be right. (Though he need not relish our perceived stupidity quite so much.)

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SrMeowMeow Hangout Grand Counsel

SrMeowMeow

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What the hell do you care how he delivers his opinion?

Who are you(or anyone else on this site for that matter) to tell someone how they can or can not express themselves?

I just don't get why people get so pissy about this stuff.

Again, if he was all lollipop about the Orioles moves, would you(or anyone else) be saying he is too over the top with his praise for the team? Would you be complaining if his delivery went the other way?

Its like the Terps fans who complain about Dickie V slurping Duke. If he did that to MD, would you complain? Would you say he is over the top?

of course not.

Let's call this what it is...People just not wanting to hear bad stuff about their team. The sooner people acknowledge that, the better off they will be and we don't have to have these threads over and over again.

Instead, we can talk about trades, cause we never get much of that talk! :D;)

I don't know why you say this...people routinely rip journalists (like Roch) for being too homerish. I just don't understand. Law is saying something that makes no sense, and no hard facts are available. Also, his tone sounds like he's enjoying painting the O's in a bad light. That suggests bias. Why is doubting him out of order?

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JanJaap AAA

JanJaap

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What the hell do you care how he delivers his opinion?

Who are you(or anyone else on this site for that matter) to tell someone how they can or can not express themselves?

I just don't get why people get so pissy about this stuff.

Again, if he was all lollipop about the Orioles moves, would you(or anyone else) be saying he is too over the top with his praise for the team? Would you be complaining if his delivery went the other way?

Its like the Terps fans who complain about Dickie V slurping Duke. If he did that to MD, would you complain? Would you say he is over the top?

of course not.

Let's call this what it is...People just not wanting to hear bad stuff about their team. The sooner people acknowledge that, the better off they will be and we don't have to have these threads over and over again.

Instead, we can talk about trades, cause we never get much of that talk! :D;)

You are absolutely right.

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Frobby Hangout Grand Counsel

Frobby

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That's worth rep points. Law plays into the hands of the miserable Orioles fan who thinks nothing has changed despite the mountain of evidence that DD has changed things. They like to sit on their high horse and tell everyone how miserable the organization is currently even though it clearly has a new direction.

Whether that direction ends up better than last place remains to be seen, but the resume of the new guys into the organization certainly attest to DD's new direction. Those "old guys" he brought in have a history of building organizations into winners. It remains to be seen whether it will work but only those too caught up in themselves are so willing to just take whatever blabber that comes out of Law's mouth/keyboard.

I don't know enough about why Thomas, Poitevint and Ferreira were available to say whether Law is right or wrong. Clearly, the guys who Law is connected to in the scouting world think these are three great-grandfather types who are 20 years past their prime. Duquette thinks they have a lot of experience and something left in the tank. It is not clear to me who is right and who is wrong. But it would not surprise me if a lot of people in baseball agree with Law.

His other point is that Duquette wasn't particularly successful with his "Asian strategy" while in Boston. I don't know much about what he did there.

I am very pleased with the degree to which Duquette has shaken up the organization, but whether he has picked the right guys remains to be seen.

As to whether the Korean kid turns into a prospect or not, I don't know, but I seriously doubt that he throws 80-83 mph, has no secondaries and the O's gave him $550k, as Law said in his tweet. The O's are not that stupid.

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Fan4Life Hangout Veteran Council

Fan4Life

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Who cares. He is right. Who cares about his delivery. What would you rather he do? Speak in a Marilyn Monroe voice and tell you the Orioles suck?

And don't you already know that the Orioles suck? So who care what Keith Law thinks?

I'd like for any analysis to leave open the possibility that the organization while being the laughing stock of MLB for years, may be heading for better days. That fact that he doesn't even leave open this possibility, as apparently neither do you, tells me his analysis is tainted.

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