This triple by Gunnar

[Sports Guy]

Just now, Frobby said:

I’d be thrilled if we got either one of them extended.   

Watching Gunnar as this season goes along is a little like watching Audrey II in Little Shop of Horrors.   FEED ME!!!
 

What an odd comparison.  Lol

[The Goob]

10 hours ago, banks703 said:

I’ve seen a lot of both of them in the minors. Gunnar at 19 was pretty advanced defensively and a lot further along than is Holliday. Holliday’s arm is never going to catch Gunnar’s and Gunnar has more range. The thought has been that Gunnar outgrows the position, which may happen. 
 

From the amount that I’ve seen of both of them, it’s my opinion that Gunnar has a better chance to stick at SS than does Holliday. That’s me assuming that Joey Ortiz gets moved because he’s better defensively than everyone else in the system. 

I agree with this.  I think Gunnar is the most likely of the two to be the SS.  But don't completely discount Ortiz actually being the long term SS.  He is the best defensively by all accounts and now has a .337/.399/.549 slash line in nearly 200 AB in AAA.  I could see Gunnar outgrowing SS and it being Gunnar at 3B, Ortiz at SS, Holiday at 2B and Westburg/Kjerstad at 1B.

Holiday said on the Adam Jones Podcast a week or so ago that he grew up as a second baseman.  I sure he was switched to SS because of draft status and rankings always favoring a SS over a 2B

[eddie83]

11 hours ago, Frobby said:

I don’t really understand what this means.   Whoever is the better shortstop will play shortstop.   The other one will play some other position.  It’s about putting the team in the best position to win games.  Nobody is going to be “devalued.”

It means Holliday is not going to be playing second base. His value would not be as high there. Gunnar playing 3rd and Holliday SS is my guess. 

The Orioles didn’t draft him with the top pick to play second. 

[Frobby]

8 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

It means Holliday is not going to be playing second base. His value would not be as high there. Gunnar playing 3rd and Holliday SS is my guess. 

The Orioles didn’t draft him with the top pick to play second. 

I’m sorry, but I don’t give a damn where he was drafted.  He’ll play at whatever spot gives the Orioles the best chance to win, given the other personnel on the team.  Manny was moved to 3B because Hardy was the better SS.   Cal was moved to 3B because Bordick was the better SS.   Grich was moved to 2B because Belanger was the better SS.  And those teams won more games because of it.  

[LA2]

12 hours ago, Frobby said:

It may have been scored a triple for technical reasons, but what a stupid, lazy play by Arozarena.   I’m glad Gunnar made him pay for it.  

It took "baseball sense" to pick up on it and Gunnar definitely has it.

Of course, it's very out of character for the generally high-spirited Arozarena--and unfortunately a drop in the bucket compared to what he has done and will do to the Orioles. What a rivalry the Rays and O's are going to be in the coming years--the battle of the budget & development magicians!

[banks703]

31 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

It means Holliday is not going to be playing second base. His value would not be as high there. Gunnar playing 3rd and Holliday SS is my guess. 

The Orioles didn’t draft him with the top pick to play second. 

This is a silly take.

The Yankees didn't sign Soriano or Cano to play 2nd base but they both turned out alright at 2nd.  

The O's drafted Jackson Holliday because of his bat. Where he ends up in the field is irrelevant. There've been PLENTY of good, high drafted SS that move positions. Jackson Holliday will be another one when he makes it to the major leagues. Bank on it. 

 

 

[Frobby]

6 minutes ago, LA2 said:

It took "baseball sense" to pick up on it and Gunnar definitely has it.

Of course, it's very out of character for the generally high-spirited Arozarena--and unfortunately a drop in the bucket compared to what he has done and will do to the Orioles. What a rivalry the Rays and O's are going to be in the coming years--the battle of the budget & development magicians!

Arozarena has these occasional brain farts on the diamond.   It’s not the first time I’ve seen him do something quite dumb.  I believe he made a really terrible baserunning mistake earlier this year against us, and I’ve seen other things from him.  At the same time, he’s an excellent player who generally plays with a lot of passion.  And, he’s certainly been an Orioles killer over the years.  Not last night though.  

[RZNJ]

43 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

It means Holliday is not going to be playing second base. His value would not be as high there. Gunnar playing 3rd and Holliday SS is my guess. 

The Orioles didn’t draft him with the top pick to play second. 

There is just no logic here at all.   The last sentence is just silly.

[Gurgi]

10 minutes ago, banks703 said:

This is a silly take.

The Yankees didn't sign Soriano or Cano to play 2nd base but they both turned out alright at 2nd.  

The O's drafted Jackson Holliday because of his bat. Where he ends up in the field is irrelevant. There've been PLENTY of good, high drafted SS that move positions. Jackson Holliday will be another one when he makes it to the major leagues. Bank on it. 

 

 

I remember when the Orioles had Roberto Alomar.  He was dynamic and probably the best all around player on the team.  He also just played second.  If Gunnar is going to be our Ripken let Jackson be our Roberto.   

[Frobby]

3 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

There is just no logic here at all.   The last sentence is just silly.

I believe the O’s drafted Holliday 1:1 because they thought he was more likely than anyone else in the draft to help them win a ton of baseball games.  

Edited July 21, 2023 by Frobby

[Sports Guy]

Just now, Gurgi said:

I remember when the Orioles had Roberto Alomar.  He was dynamic and probably the best all around player on the team.  He also just played second.  If Gunnar is going to be our Ripken let Jackson be our Roberto.   

But that was his position and the position he was signed to play.

I understand what you are trying to say but in the context of this discussion, it ma not a good comp.

[Sports Guy]

1 minute ago, Frobby said:

I believe the O’s drafted Holliday 1:1 because they thought he was more likely than anyone else in the draft to help them win a ton of baseball games.  

Sure..and they believed that he could do playing SS and that was essentially the stated reason why they took him over other players.

[Gurgi]

1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

But that was his position and the position he was signed to play.

I understand what you are trying to say but in the context of this discussion, it ma not a good comp.

I really am just making the point that a player can dominate the league and really help his team playing second.  I just think if Gunnar is playing great SS then why move him when Jackson gets here?  Earl said draft all SS and he would figure it out.   

I dont even think Jackson would feel upset about playing second if the SS was playing at a Cal Ripken like level.  The kid is a mature kid.  

This is like rich man problems we are having.  Figuring out where to put all the GG capable all star worthy SS.  

[Frobby]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Sure..and they believed that he could do playing SS and that was essentially the stated reason why they took him over other players.

Obviously, it is nice to have a guy capable of playing a good SS.  But that doesn’t mean the team is going to put him there if another alignment gives them a better chance to win.  

[RZNJ]

6 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I believe the O’s drafted Holliday 1:1 because they thought he was more likely than anyone else in the draft to help them win a ton of baseball games.  

Agreed, and the fact that he might be able to stick defensively as a SS played into it but it didn’t define his future.   If Holliday is better defensively than Henderson no problem here but from what I’ve seen, Gunnar is to make the decision easy.    He’s big but he’s an amazing athlete out there.   The foot work, ability to dive and get back to his feet quickly, the cannon arm.    Holliday is athletic, I’m sure.   I just think Gunnar is on another level than his buddies and it shows.