I'm a little disappointed in AM

[JTrea81]

Even if you think the OF is a question, 1) you cannot think it is the most pressing need, and 2) wouldn't it make sense to see your young OF for a little more time to determine whether or not they are long term solutions? Your argument is based upon adding talent when available so you don't have to do it in one off-season. But the problem is you are advocating making an unnecessary move a year early (filling an OF void) simply because you don't like any other "big moves" that might be out there.

If at the end of the season the O's shape up to have four LEGIT starters in Matusz, Tillman, Bergesen and Arrieta to go along with Guthrie, are you still going to advocate a big contract for Beckett simply because it's available premium talent that can make the team better? Or are you going to look at what makes the most sense for BAL at that time?

A RH #4 hitter is a pressing need, and there are two out there now that can be signed for potentially below market value as neither has much of a market due to the poor economy and teams not having payroll room. Holliday is the best of the two.

And I'd never argue for Beckett or Lee just because I know MacPhail would never sign a pitcher like that. What's the point?

I actually think he'd be willing to sign Holliday because he said "buy the bats."

[Stotle]

True we can trade for someone, if you want to give up Tillman most likely.

How can you know what needs to be given up if you don't know what you are trading for or what your players will be worth in a year? You have to think a little more broadly if you want to honestly discuss potential future rules.

Almost seems like you've made up your mind as to what the future holds for every particular player of interest and are forming opinions predicated almost exclusively upon those biases.

[wildcard]

If you add one player now, that's one player you don't have to add later.

MacPhail did that when he signed Gonzalez. He may do it again if he signs Bedard or trades Scott.

It looks to me that MacPhail is building up the pitching staff so at some point he can trade a pitcher for a bat that might be needed. I am not saying the trade for the bat will happen this off season but MacPhail seems to be working in the that direction.

[smittyjones]

AM is the only reason this team has ANY hope to begin with. JMO, Thank god for AM, keep up the great work!!!!!

[Bradysburns]

See there is no perfect fit for the Orioles. Teixeira was and now that opportunity has passed. Now we've got to take what we can get.

Holliday is a RH #4 bat and so is Bay. Just because they don't play 1B doesn't mean we shouldn't be pursuing them, Holliday especially because of his ties to Atkins and Roberts.

We can't just keep waiting for that "right player" otherwise we may miss out on opportunities to add players that can really make a difference on this club.

The more talent we pass on, that's more talent we'll have to add in the future. Our young players will only develop to a certain point and we'll need a lot more talent than just them to compete.

I agree - to say we're "set" in the outfield is ludicrous. We have a lot of POTENTIAL in the outfield. I'm referring to LF particularly. I would say we're set at CF and RF. But LF is a question mark. We had about five guys play there in 2009. Reimold is a promising guy but he's a prospect still... same for Pie... and Scott isn't a left fielder.

Besides, Reimold and Pie would both have big roles to fill even if you got Bay or Holliday.

The point is, you could significantly upgrade. The Yankees had Jeter at short... but they still signed A. Rod. Why? Because he was an upgrade... and they put him on third. This is the whole method of going from bad to good... good to great. You are always looking for a chance to upgrade your lineup, not waiting for the "perfect" player to magically fall into your lap.

[smittyjones]

I agree - to say we're "set" in the outfield is ludicrous. We have a lot of POTENTIAL in the outfield. I'm referring to LF particularly. I would say we're set at CF and RF. But LF is a question mark. We had about five guys play there in 2009. Reimold is a promising guy but he's a prospect still... same for Pie... and Scott isn't a left fielder.

Besides, Reimold and Pie would both have big roles to fill even if you got Bay or Holliday.

The point is, you could significantly upgrade. The Yankees had Jeter at short... but they still signed A. Rod. Why? Because he was an upgrade... and they put him on third. This is the whole method of going from bad to good... good to great. You are always looking for a chance to upgrade your lineup, not waiting for the "perfect" player to magically fall into your lap.

I don't know man, using the Yankees as a baseline on how the O's should proceed is kinda setting your sights a little bit high. I understand it's not literal, but it's just not a fair comparison.

[scOtt]

The point is, you could significantly upgrade. The Yankees had Jeter at short... but they still signed A. Rod. Why? Because he was an upgrade... and they put him on third. This is the whole method of going from bad to good... good to great. You are always looking for a chance to upgrade your lineup, not waiting for the "perfect" player to magically fall into your lap.

You do have somewhat of a point, but that's not a good example at all. The Yanks had a hole at third and it's not much of a stretch to move from short to third. To ask any of our players (or Holliday) to move from LF to first is completely different. Apples and oranges.

[Lucky Jim]

You do have somewhat of a point, but that's not a good example at all. The Yanks had a hole at third and it's not much of a stretch to move from short to third. To ask any of our players (or Holliday) to move from LF to first is completely different. Apples and oranges.

The bigger issue, I think, is that the Yankees can afford the inefficiency inherent in moving A-Rod to 3rd. His time at SS was likely winding down due to his size/development. Further, the Yankees don't need to maximize payroll efficiency like the O's do, so two years of him at 3B instead of SS wasn't that big of a deal.

[Old#5fan]

Going into this off-season ( and I know there's plenty of time left), I sort of figured this was our years. Not to win the WS or anything, but to acquire one or two quality players to close the distance between the NY and Boston teams,set us for 2011 and 2012.

The FA pool was thin I admit. But look around. The economy is in the crapper, teams are dumping salary. MLB is well aware we have followed the formula to build a winning franchise. AND we had plenty to spend.

Just one high quality player at a position, a guy who contributes a lot offensively. I don't want to cripple the teams with a huge contract. A good defensive players with some good pop in his bat. But still, it's more of the same. I would be very pleased to add one solid player to the nuclues of the club each season

I hope AM has some cards up his sleeve, and isn't depending on one more year of seasoning for our young players.

I agree with you as I was much more impressed with AM's moves when he first arrived as in the Tejada and Bedard trades. This year to me has been ming boggling bad as far as his doing anything that will improve this team's chances in the AL East. He should have added someone like Millwood last year so he is a year too late in that move. He also has not added a big bat in the middle of the lineup. So in my estimation this off season has been his worst by far.

This team is not going anywhere but downhill if he thinks these young kids are going to develop into superstars to carry a cellar dwelling team like the Orioles to the level where they can even remotely compete with the big boys in this division. Those same folks here who are defending AM and his overly cautious to the point of boring moves this offseason I predict will be clamoring for his head by the EOY. Just watch and see (unless he totally shocks us by signing someone like Holliday or Bay).

[Lucky Jim]

Those same folks here who are defending AM and his overly cautious to the point of boring moves this offseason I predict will be clamoring for his head by the EOY. Just watch and see (unless he totally shocks us by signing someone like Holliday or Bay.

More predictions to back away from?

[Old#5fan]

More predictions to back away from?

I never back away from any of my predictions. As I recall it you were the one who backed out of our bet at the last minute so I doubt you want to go there again?:laughlol:

I stand by my position that AM's "moves" this offseason have been boring and mindboggling bad in a very understated way as in no splash, no pizzazz with the end result no improvement whatsover to this team. (Now let's not nitpick and say if they win 1-4 games they are improved- who cares?) Last place is last place. AM has done nothing, nada, zippo, zilch, squat to elevate this team from the bottom of the division so far this offseason, when you look at what the elite teams are doing to get even better. In fact, they have widened the margin in my view.

[Moose Milligan]

How can you know what needs to be given up if you don't know what you are trading for or what your players will be worth in a year? You have to think a little more broadly if you want to honestly discuss potential future rules.

Almost seems like you've made up your mind as to what the future holds for every particular player of interest and are forming opinions predicated almost exclusively upon those biases.

This post wins the thread.

[Lucky Jim]

I never back away from any of my predictions. As I recall it you were the one who backed out of our bet at the last minute so I doubt you want to go there again?:laughlol:

I stand by my position that AM's "moves" this offseason have been boring and mindboggling bad in a very understated way as in no splash, no pizzazz with the end result no improvement whatsover to this team. (Now let's not nitpick and say if they win 1-4 games they are improved- who cares?) Last place is last place.

That would be how you remember it.

[Old#5fan]

That would be how you remember it.

So you are happy with his moves so far? You think the gap isn't widening instead of decreasing between the talent that NY and Boston have in comparison to the Orioles?

He (AM) started out great and is getting weaker and weaker each year.

Again, its like going 20mph when the speed limit is 50 and the Yankees and Boston are going 90!

[Lucky Jim]

So you are happy with his moves so far? You think the gap isn't widening instead of decreasing between the talent that NY and Boston have in comparison to the Orioles?

He started out great and is getting weaker and weaker each year.

Again, its like going 20mph when the speed limit is 50 and the Yankees and Boston are going 90!

I don't agree w/ that. I think the fundamental point you're missing is that the work the Yanks are doing is essentially to maintain the status quo. Their improvement is entirely extrinsic. The Orioles' is intrinsic. Which makes it difficult to measure one against the other.

I'm pretty good w/ the O's moves as of right now. But then again, I realize that it's not a question of now or never. And that sometimes the answer has to be something other than right now.

Folks on here clamoring for instant gratification are like children in a toy store crying in the aisles because they think the only way for their parents to prove their love is to buy them the toy on that shelf, right now. It's just not the case. Especially when there are already a ton of Christmas gifts waiting at home, waiting to be opened.