If This Team Collapse For The Second Straight Year, Doesn't Buck Have To Take A Hit?

[Can_of_corn]

Typical fan cliche criticism which can apply to any manager: He pulls SP too soon/too late, plays favorites(translation doesn't play the fan's favorite)mismanages the bull pen, poor lineup construction.

While we agree that lineup construction isn't hugely important you can't really defend batting Hardy second 150 times in 2012.

Now is it something that hurts the team? Not really.

But it is a foible.

[FanSince88]

If anything, Buck has kept the team in contention this year. Even if we collapse to end the season, at least we were still contending at the end of August. Frankly, looking at the team on paper entering the year, it could have been much worse than that.

[atomic]

Typical fan cliche criticism which can apply to any manager: He pulls SP too soon/too late, plays favorites(translation doesn't play the fan's favorite)mismanages the bull pen, poor lineup construction.

I think he runs the bull-pen fine. But other managers don't pull their starters in the first and second inning because they give up 5 runs. I think Buck's greatest strength is getting the team to play strong fundamental baseball. Before he got there they made a ton of base running mistakes and doing things like throwing to the wrong base. Overall I would say he is a good manager.

Also I like Wieters but he needs more days off. Get rid of Joseph if he can't play and bring up Pena. I am sure Buck has some say in the back-up catcher. And I have no criticized the line-up or the bull pen management. Cliche because he does some things I disagree with? There is a limit to what a manager can do. Look at Casey Stengel. 7 World Series wins and Hall of Fame manager yet he didn't do to well when not managing the Yankees. A super star manager is going to get you maybe 5 wins tops in a season over an average manager.

[SteveO]

So here is my take. Any manager from Buck to Casey Stengel can make moves or decisions that are worthy of questioning. If we let Buck go though there would be a line of teams bidding for his services and the odds we would acquire another manager who is better or even his equal is about the same as me winning powerball IMO

DD on the other hand is a different situation. While I am not saying he should go, I am not exactly thrilled with some of his choices. From some of the trades that have been made to some of the questionable signings, his performance as GM is far more shaky then Bucks as a manager.

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[atomic]

So here is my take. Any manager from Buck to Casey Stengel can make moves or decisions that are worthy of questioning. If we let Buck go though there would be a line of teams bidding for his services and the odds we would acquire another manager who is better or even his equal is about the same as me winning powerball IMO

DD on the other hand is a different situation. While I am not saying he should go, I am not exactly thrilled with some of his choices. From some of the trades that have been made to some of the questionable signings, his performance as GM is far more shaky then Bucks as a manager.

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DD traded for Trumbo, signed Alvarez, Kim and Worley. They have all been effective. I would say Buck should have played Kim more and started Worley over other guys.

[SteveO]

DD traded for Trumbo, signed Alvarez, Kim and Worley. They have all been effective. I would say Buck should have played Kim more and started Worley over other guys.

Worley I am not impressed with and as a starter even less so. Not saying that

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[SteveO]

DD traded for Trumbo, signed Alvarez, Kim and Worley. They have all been effective. I would say Buck should have played Kim more and started Worley over other guys.

Sorry...dang phone. As I was saying I don't necessarily think Dan duquette should go but I do think his performance has been more worthy of criticism.

Last year going into the Year everybody screaming about how we need Outfield help and lo and behold we needed Outfield help. This year everybody knew we need starting pitching and lo and behold we need starting pitching. The fact is that dan badly misread the pitching market and then waited to score Ubaldo part 2 okay maybe that's a little harsh but you get my point. Our farm system is every bit as devoid of talent as it was before he got here. I think there's some reason concerned about Dan as a GM long term. I don't think you just get rid of him but I don't think it's unreasonable to expect to see some significant improvement over the next year for two and if not then cutting the cord

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[Dark Helmet]

I will be fine if they decide to replace Dan Duquette after this season. As long as they don't drag it out the entire offseason and make this winter a waste.

[weams]

I will be fine if they decide to replace Dan Duquette after this season. As long as they don't drag it out the entire offseason and make this winter a waste.

Dan will leave. In 2019. And it won't be drawn out. He might well be going where he trades Manny to.

[SteveO]

Dan will leave. In 2019. And it won't be drawn out. He might well be going where he trades Manny to.

Dang Weams that's pretty pessimistic. I'm a little more hopeful than you that they'll get Manny signed. It's going to take a crap ton of money and more than likely swallowing an opt-out, but I think Peter smart enough to know how marketable Manny is and how damaging to the franchise it would be to see him walk or traded.

When I say damaging, I mean from the Casual fan perspective which is the vast majority of people who go to Camden Yards. Most of those people could care less about prospects

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[sportsfan8703]

Buck's one of the best managers in baseball. Up there with Melvin, Maddon and Botchy. Meanwhile DD is the one that has a 150 million payroll and 3 highly paid SP's with terrible ERA's.

[Can_of_corn]

I just want to say, since I have been defending my issues with Buck's managing, that I don't blame him if the team falls short this year.

[TouchemAll]

60 starts combined from

Gallardo

Wilson

Wright

Jimenez

Combined ErA of 5.90, averaging 5.2 innings a start. Team is 30-30 in those starts.

Kind of GLARING isn't it.

[slakattack]

I just want to say, since I have been defending my issues with Buck's managing, that I don't blame him if the team falls short this year.

Exactly. Despite explanations, people read what they want to read from your (or my) posts. Some people come on here for the sole purpose of playing point-counter point.

[sportsfan8703]

Of course it means that.

Team is 9-13 when KG starts.

Pretty amazing to be .500 for 60 starts that are that horrible.

Tillman 20-6

Worley 3-1

Miley 1-3

Bundy 4-3

YG 9-8

Wilson 6-7

Wright 7-5

Ubaldo 8-10

LOL. This team was just mashing the ball early on. We gave away so many games with terrible starts pre ASB. I don't see how Buck gets anything but praise this year.