Fielder?

[waroriole]

Fielder is a competitor, have you not seen how passionate he is?

This is the same guy who wanted to take on the whole Dodgers clubhouse...

I was referring to the kind of shape he keeps himself in. He's a few donuts from being out of baseball. Belle was a specimen.

[JTrea81]

I was referring to the kind of shape he keeps himself in. He's a few donuts from being out of baseball. Belle was a specimen.

"There was a point where it hit me and it dawned on me exactly what we had," Yost said. "I thought he was for real the whole time. But in terms of being a baseball player, he far exceeded what I thought he was. I couldn't see the passion and the intensity that he plays with. I'd just see him in spring training as a young player. I didn't see that other side of him. … He could be the most intense player I've ever seen or been around."

He has the ability to go from super playful, joking around, to flipping the switch almost instantly," said Brewers outfielder Tony Gwynn Jr., who is one of Fielder's closest friends. "It's to the point where you're like, 'Did something happen? Is he OK?' It's almost scary sometimes. As soon he makes that walk from the locker room to the dugout, it's a completely different dude."

...

There is no in between with Fielder. He is motivated by his past, by his insecurities, by his family, by his exposed emotions. His talent is undeniable, but that's not the sole reason he's within viewing distance of greatness. He is there because of that sweet swing, but also because of that inner turmoil.

Too fat. Too much like his old man. Too underpaid. There's always something. There has to be.

He recently read a book about the inhumane treatment of animals at slaughterhouses. So he gave up meat a month ago.

He committed 14 errors in 2007. Now he has a fielding jones. Third-base coach Dale Sveum can't hit him enough grounders.

He hasn't hit a home run yet during spring training. That's OK. The left-handed-hitting Fielder is wearing out what Gwynn calls the "5.5 hole": the gap between the third baseman and the shortstop. Try overplaying him to pull now. He dares you.

Tomorrow, there could be another villain for Fielder. But for now, the renewed contract will do just fine.

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=wojciechowski_gene&id=3276033&sportCat=mlb

[waroriole]

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=wojciechowski_gene&id=3276033&sportCat=mlb

What does that have to do with the kind of shape he is in?

[Mad Mark]

If he's a Boras client, he'll be a Yankee. Next.

[JTrea81]

What does that have to do with the kind of shape he is in?

Having some girth has nothing to do with competitiveness. Fielder is a firey competitor on the field, and that is something that is sorely lacking on the Orioles.

He's in baseball shape. The weight will be a concern, but it also reduces his price.

[scOtt]

I was referring to the kind of shape he keeps himself in. He's a few donuts from being out of baseball. Belle was a specimen.

I disagree with MSK. Fielder is his old man. Maybe a little more raw talent, but the same career girth pattern.

[Babypowder]

I disagree with MSK. Fielder is his old man. Maybe a little more raw talent, but the same career girth pattern.

Prince is already bigger than his father ever was during his playing days. There's just no way he holds up for the length of the next contract he signs.

[lovetoaster]

I just got back from Milwaukee and did not really expect how unpopular he is with at least some of the fans up there. I went to the game on Thursday afternoon and heard a lot about his poor attitude, his lack of hustle, his lack of respect for the game and his general lack of clutch hitting. Not my words, theirs.

He did hit a two-run homer in this game, so of course there was a lot of cheering for him then, but I get the do not think the fans are really concerned about him moving on. A lot of people sure do not want to give him a big contract, because they worry about how his attitude and hustle would be after getting a huge paycheck. I share those same concerns to an extent.

[JTrea81]

I just got back from Milwaukee and did not really expect how unpopular he is with at least some of the fans up there. I went to the game on Thursday afternoon and heard a lot about his poor attitude, his lack of hustle, his lack of respect for the game and his general lack of clutch hitting. Not my words, theirs.

He did hit a two-run homer in this game, so of course there was a lot of cheering for him then, but I get the do not think the fans are really concerned about him moving on. A lot of people sure do not want to give him a big contract, because they worry about how his attitude and hustle would be after getting a huge paycheck. I share those same concerns to an extent.

He has done poorly with RISP this year, but for his career he has an .875 OPS. In 2009 he had a 1.049 OPS with RISP.

[lovetoaster]

He has done poorly with RISP this year, but for his career he has an .875 OPS. In 2009 he had a 1.049 OPS with RISP.

Not necessarily when they have RISP, but their beef was that a lot of his homers and RBIs come when the game is out of hand. That a lot of his numbers are hollow and somewhat misleading. That he can homer in the ninth inning of a game that they are losing 8-1, but he can't hit a single with a runner in scoring position when they are down 2-1. Also that he makes no effort to hit the ball the other way anymore, just tries to pull everything and hit it six miles.

I don't know, I honestly have not paid a lot of attention to him, other than seeing his overall stats and plenty of highlights. So I cannot offer a solid opinion either way. But when I brought up our hole at 1B and that a good amount of people in Baltimore would want Prince, most of the responses that I got were similar to "you can have him."

[waroriole]

Having some girth has nothing to do with competitiveness. Fielder is a firey competitor on the field, and that is something that is sorely lacking on the Orioles.

He's in baseball shape. The weight will be a concern, but it also reduces his price.

I'll try one more time. What does "fire" have to do with his weight problems? You can try to dismiss it if you want, but it's a legit concern.

[brendanmdeegan]

Let someone else take on that kind of monetary commitment/risk.

A huge financial outlay like that to a player with old-player skills, a body that could very well put him out of baseball during the course of a long-term contract, and is highly likely to have his best seasons behind him before entering into such a deal is potentially back breaking to a team like the Orioles.

I have posted this in other threads, but check out Mo Vaughn's numbers as a comparison.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/v/vaughmo01.shtml

After his age 27 season (where the majority of players peak) he had:

- 3 very good years

-2 decent years

-2 crappy years.

Prince Fielder is bigger than Vaughn by the way.

Would you be willing to pay uber bucks for similar production? It's a huge risk for a team like the Orioles. The Yankee$ and Red$ox can afford to be more cavalier with their risks, but I hate a deal like this for the Orioles.

[Sports Guy]

I'll try one more time. What does "fire" have to do with his weight problems? You can try to dismiss it if you want, but it's a legit concern.

Yes, its a legit concern and probably why I wouldn't give him a contract of over 6 years.

However, he should be able to be ok for the next 4-6 years.

If there was something to be concerned about, it would be that his LD% has gone down every year since 2007.

However, his defense has improved a lot according to his UZR numbers...so, he has obviously worked on that.

IMO, a fair market contract for him, if he were a FA, would be 5/85 or so. In his first 4 full years, he was worth, on average, 17.3 million a year...Now, that number was greatly driven up by last year but it was also driven down by the year before.

He is probably a guy that will be worth anywhere from 3-6 wins a year for the next 5 years or so. That has him worth anywhere from 12-25ish million a year. So, giving him a yearly salary somewhere in the middle of that is a fair deal.

The problem is, there is no way he signs that deal as part of an extension and no way he signs that deal in Baltimore.

I would guess we would need to put Tex or better money on the table to get him to even consider signing an extension here.

The best thing for the Orioles to do, if they want to acquire Fielder is to probably wait to sign him when he becomes a FA...Its a gamble, because he may work really hard to be in better shape for his impending FA season and have some monster year...However, they could get picks or maybe even trade him next July if needs be.

Of course, it depends on what it would take to get him...And the other thing you have to consider is what can the players you would deal for him net you in return.

For example, if Guthrie nets you Chris Davis, then you have to consider that when thinking about trading him in a deal for Fielder, if the Brewers were interested in Guthrie as part of the deal.

[JTrea81]

Let someone else take on that kind of monetary commitment/risk.

A huge financial outlay like that to a player with old-player skills, a body that could very well put him out of baseball during the course of a long-term contract, and is highly likely to have his best seasons behind him before entering into such a deal is potentially back breaking to a team like the Orioles.

I have posted this in other threads, but check out Mo Vaughn's numbers as a comparison.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/v/vaughmo01.shtml

After his age 27 season (where the majority of players peak) he had:

- 3 very good years

-2 decent years

-2 crappy years.

Prince Fielder is bigger than Vaughn by the way.

Would you be willing to pay uber bucks for similar production? It's a huge risk for a team like the Orioles. The Yankee$ and Red$ox can afford to be more cavalier with their risks, but I hate a deal like this for the Orioles.

You give him more money for less years. Something like a 6/150 extension should do it. I don't see anybody going more than 6 years for him after 2011 just because of his body type and down season this year.

[waroriole]

IMO, a fair market contract for him, if he were a FA, would be 5/85 or so. In his first 4 full years, he was worth, on average, 17.3 million a year...Now, that number was greatly driven up by last year but it was also driven down by the year before.

He is probably a guy that will be worth anywhere from 3-6 wins a year for the next 5 years or so. That has him worth anywhere from 12-25ish million a year. So, giving him a yearly salary somewhere in the middle of that is a fair deal.

The problem with this is that Howard's deal set the bar way higher (5/125). That would be the starting point in an extension, and that is just a really bad idea. Of course, Fielder is younger so he's going to want more years on that, so probably 7/175. I agree, if you're set on Fielder sign him as a FA. Unless you get a great bargain.