Mussina does not make my HOF ballot

[Tx Oriole]

If I had a vote Randy Johnson is the only player I would vote to go in this year.

How about you?

http://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/hof_2015.shtml

I go along with you on Johnson.

[weams]

I go along with you on Johnson.

Johnson, Pedro, Smoltz.

[crawjo]

If I had a vote Randy Johnson is the only player I would vote to go in this year.

How about you?

http://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/hof_2015.shtml

I'm glad you aren't a voter. There are more than 15 deserving candidates on this year's ballot. If I can only vote for ten, I'm voting for Johnson, Martinez, Biggio, Piazza, Raines, Mussina, Schilling, Smoltz, Bagwell, and Bonds. But if I could vote for more than ten, I would also vote for Clemens, Walker, Kent, Trammell, McGriff, Sheffield, Edgar Martinez, Mark McGwire, and Sammy Sosa.

The ballot is a total mess because of the lack of consensus on whether players found to have used steroids should be eligible and are deserving.

[nevadaO]

By 31 I am sure you mean 34 since at 31 he put up an ERA+ of 211.

Pedro's five starts in 2007 were because the Mets had better options.

Didn't Jones enter the league at age 19 or something too? I'd say 19-33 is a solid number of years.

[ArtVanDelay]

If I had a vote Randy Johnson is the only player I would vote to go in this year.

How about you?

http://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/hof_2015.shtml

No Pedro Martinez? Wow.

[ArtVanDelay]

Not a very good case.

They both led the league in ERA 5 times; but WJ is more impressive in everything else.

ERA+: 6 to 5

FIP: 9 to 5

Ks: 12 to 3

K/9: 7 to 5

K:BB: 9 to 4

IP: 5 to 0

WJ's career was clearly a cut above Pedro's.

You do realize that Walter Johnson pitched a lot of his career in the dead ball era and Pedro Martinez pitched in the steroid era?

[Frobby]

You do realize that Walter Johnson pitched a lot of his career in the dead ball era and Pedro Martinez pitched in the steroid era?

Why is that relevant when the poster to whom you were responding was posting stats about how the two pitchers did relative to the other pitchers in their leagues at the time, not stats that are era-dependent?

Probably more relevant to say that Martinez pitched when there were 14 teams in the league, African Americans were allowed to play and players from Latin America and other parts of the world were being heavily recruited.

The one knock on Martinez is that he wasn't that durable.

[Orioles4Life21]

Not putting in Pedro is laughable. He'll easily get in this year. As he should.

[foxfield]

Pedro is going in, but I do think there is room to debate when. For example, his body of work is over 1000 innings pitched compared to Randy Johnson. That's a lot of innings. Again, I think he is in, he would have my vote now. But, his body of work includes a very good career wrapped around a super nova period of dominance. It should be interesting.

[weams]

Not putting in Pedro is laughable. He'll easily get in this year. As he should.

I think he may have been the best pitcher I ever saw. I might Still put Bob Gibson first. they were both amazing.

[AlbionHero]

Pedro is going in, but I do think there is room to debate when. For example, his body of work is over 1000 innings pitched compared to Randy Johnson. That's a lot of innings. Again, I think he is in, he would have my vote now. But, his body of work includes a very good career wrapped around a super nova period of dominance. It should be interesting.

The voters care a lot about the counting numbers. I'd be shocked if he's first ballot, since 219 wins isn't a lot. I doubt theres been any pitchers to make it in first ballot other than Koufax (who had to retire early due to injury) with 219 or less wins.

Baseball reference has these guys as his closest comparison in counting stats:

Roy Halladay (874)

Curt Schilling (870)

Tim Hudson (864)

Bob Caruthers (860)

CC Sabathia (859)

Whitey Ford (851)

Dwight Gooden (851)

Kevin Brown (846)

Juan Marichal (839)

Chief Bender (836)

A few hall of famers, but not many guys there you'd consider first ballot HoF. That'll count against him.

[Orioles4Life21]

The voters care a lot about the counting numbers. I'd be shocked if he's first ballot, since 219 wins isn't a lot. I doubt theres been any pitchers to make it in first ballot other than Koufax (who had to retire early due to injury) with 219 or less wins.

Baseball reference has these guys as his closest comparison in counting stats:

Roy Halladay (874)

Curt Schilling (870)

Tim Hudson (864)

Bob Caruthers (860)

CC Sabathia (859)

Whitey Ford (851)

Dwight Gooden (851)

Kevin Brown (846)

Juan Marichal (839)

Chief Bender (836)

A few hall of famers, but not many guys there you'd consider first ballot HoF. That'll count against him.

Well that logic is outdated and quite frankly, stupid.

[wildcard]

Pedro was freaking awesome' date=' legendary peak years. No way is he not in on the first ballot and I would love to make a bet with anyone who think he won't make it the first time around.

Possibly the 2 greatest seasons ever

1999 - 2.07 ERA, 243 ERA+, 0.923 WHIP, FIP 1.39!

2000 - 1.74 ERA 291 ERA+, 0.737 WHIP, FIP 2.17

In the height of the steroid year pitching for the Sox at Fenway!

3 Cy Youngs and 2 second place finishes.

ERA+ 154! Ahead of Clemens, Maddux, Johnson etc.

Wildcard, would you also not vote for Koufax who wasn't as good his Pedro?[/quote']

I probably would not have voted for Koufax on his first year of eligibility. I didn't say that Koufax or Pedro were no HOFers.

[wildcard]

Can't believe Wildcard got a ballot and I didn't:)

Bonds

Clemens

Lee Smith

R Johnson

Pedro

Biggio

Need more info/research on Smoltz.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I agree. You should always get a ballot before me. So you will let the cheapers in but not Rose. Interesting.

[beervendor]

I think he may have been the best pitcher I ever saw. I might Still put Bob Gibson first. they were both amazing.

Gibson and Koufax were sadly (depending on your priorities, I suppose) before my time. Best pitchers I ever saw - at their peak - are Pedro, RJ, Maddux, Rivera, Gooden. God I love baseball.