Matt Harvey close to minor league deal. (Update: signed)

[Sports Guy]

7 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Oh, Rodriguez got arrested almost two whole years earlier so he wasn't a reprehensible human being?  That how it works?  Oh the team was good so it's OK to trade for someone like that?  Is there a sliding scale I'm not aware of?

First of all, stop acting like you are some moral authority.  It’s hilarious when you do that.

Secondly, I didn’t say it was ok but it is different.  End of the day, these guys are just pieces to help you win.  I don’t care a whole lot about off field stuff although I certainly would prefer a certain type of person to be on my teams.

That said, yes you do overlook stuff when you are winning and players fit a role. It doesn’t negate what they did and doesn’t make them a good person but it does make it easier to overlook.

Harvey doesn’t help us win, doesn’t help the young players and isn’t ultra talented.  He doesn’t fit in any of the requirements usually needed to deal with the baggage.

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, glenn__davis said:

I can't speak for everyone.  I absolutely saw issues with the others.  But at least, from a baseball standpoint, I understood that those players had value, whether or not I agreed with the acquisition.

Matt Harvey has no such value.  He in no way makes the team better.  You could sign or cheaply acquire a dozen players that are better than him at this point in his career.  What on earth is the point of this signing, given the issues at hand?

He did finish with the second most innings of an Oriole starter last year.  Had the lowest FIP. 

If you can get that on a minor league deal and the other stuff doesn't bother you why not?

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

First of all, stop acting like you are some moral authority.  It’s hilarious when you do that.

Secondly, I didn’t say it was ok but it is different.  End of the day, these guys are just pieces to help you win.  I don’t care a whole lot about off field stuff although I certainly would prefer a certain type of person to be on my teams.

That said, yes you do overlook stuff when you are winning and players fit a role. It doesn’t negate what they did and doesn’t make them a good person but it does make it easier to overlook.

Harvey doesn’t help us win, doesn’t help the young players and isn’t ultra talented.  He doesn’t fit in any of the requirements usually needed to deal with the baggage.

See, I think it's hilarious when folks act like they care about one guys behavior while ignoring the behavior issues of someone else simply because they are more skilled.

 

[Sports Guy]

9 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

See, I think it's hilarious when folks act like they care about one guys behavior while ignoring the behavior issues of someone else simply because they are more skilled.

 

That’s because it’s sports.  End of the day, do you help us get better?  That’s ultimately what matters.  
 

I would prefer not to have a POS on my team but if they help me win, so be it.  When Young hit that double against Detroit, no one cared that he was human garbage.  

That’s just reality.  

 

[Moose Milligan]

Human garbage, eh?  

 

[RZNJ]

4 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Human garbage, eh?  

 

And Delmon didn't even get into a heated debate with him on OH.  That's rough.

[Sports Guy]

10 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Human garbage, eh?  

 

Beat up a woman and that’s basically what you are.

[Going Underground]

3 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

That’s because it’s sports.  End of the day, do you help us get better?  That’s ultimately what matters.  
 

I would prefer not to have a POS on my team but if they help me win, so be it.  When Young hit that double against Detroit, no one cared that he was human garbage.  

That’s just reality.  

 

Just look up Miquel Cabrera's history. But a great player Former NFL player running for Senate. Terrell Suggs from the Ravens also loved.

[Frobby]

3 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

See, I think it's hilarious when folks act like they care about one guys behavior while ignoring the behavior issues of someone else simply because they are more skilled.

 

If a player has had off the field issues, I think the team looks at it from several different perspectives:

1.   Is the conduct something likely to be repeated while with the team?

2.  Does management find the behavior so repugnant that the player isn’t worth having no matter what?

3.  Will the other members of the team have a problem with the player?

4.  Will the fan base be offended if the player is on the team?

5.  Could the player face consequences of his past behavior that could disrupt his season or be a major distraction that will affect his performance?

6.  How good a player is he?   Can his contributions outweigh the negative considerations?

There might be some other things I’m not thinking of.  

I think item 2 almost never comes into play.   Most situations are a balancing of the other factors.   

Personally I didn’t want Harvey back even before I knew about the drug issues.   So the drug issues are just one more reason not to sign him.   Obviously the O’s saw it differently.  

 

[SteveA]

As long as we're signing Harvey, maybe we should give this guy a look.

https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/former-yankees-third-round-pick-released-amid-allegations-of-stealing-selling-teammates-equipment/

[Sports Guy]

2 minutes ago, SteveA said:

As long as we're signing Harvey, maybe we should give this guy a look.

https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/former-yankees-third-round-pick-released-amid-allegations-of-stealing-selling-teammates-equipment/

He's an entrepreneur!

[spiritof66]

 

On 5/18/2022 at 8:38 AM, Sports Guy said:

 .  .  .

Harvey doesn't  help us win, doesn’t help the young players and isn’t ultra talented.  He doesn’t fit in any of the requirements usually needed to deal with the baggage.

Harvey's got big-league experience (including suffering through a season with the Orioles), he's willing to pitch in the minors, and he's cheap. Isn't that one of the commodities Elias is looking for?

I don't know about his helping young pitchers. I assume there's zero or minimal value there, but that could be wrong.

[NelsonCruuuuuz]

On 5/18/2022 at 8:10 AM, waroriole said:

I hope you eventually see the world isn’t so black and white. Matt Harvey can make a terrible decision and do some bad things, but it doesn’t mean he is a terrible person who shouldn’t have a chance for redemption. Nobody on here knows what’s in his heart. I imagine he’s felt a lot of grief over what happened to Skaggs, and I hope he’s able to learn from his mistakes and live a better life. 

Thanks for the post Sir. I don’t see things like that and your point is a good one. I will reiterate my view: he was beyond awful last year and likely wouldn’t have been in the bigs if not for us. Couple that with this bad look, why sign him? It’s like he is being arrogant about how little he cares about being competitive. I do think what he did was wrong however but agree we all deserve a shot at redemption. Life is short and hard and your post is a thoughtful one. Thank you.

[waroriole]

35 minutes ago, NelsonCruuuuuz said:

Thanks for the post Sir. I don’t see things like that and your point is a good one. I will reiterate my view: he was beyond awful last year and likely wouldn’t have been in the bigs if not for us. Couple that with this bad look, why sign him? It’s like he is being arrogant about how little he cares about being competitive. I do think what he did was wrong however but agree we all deserve a shot at redemption. Life is short and hard and your post is a thoughtful one. Thank you.

From a baseball standpoint, I completely agree. He’s not a ML pitcher anymore and it didn’t make sense to bring him back. Especially when he had this hanging over him. 
 

And thanks for a thoughtful response. Your post was hardly the only one critical of him as a person, but you seem to be an open minded person, so I directed it at you with the idea that you’d appreciate what I was saying. 

[NCRaven]

42 minutes ago, NelsonCruuuuuz said:

 I will reiterate my view: he was beyond awful last year...

Did you read Corn's post, above.  He was second on the O's in innings pitched and first in FIP.  At the time he was signed, we had low expectations for the pitching staff.  As it is, they have been surpisingly good.  With Bradish coming up, along with Rodriguez's and Hall's expected promotions at some point this year, I don't expect to see much of Harvey, if at all.  If we suffer more season ending injuries, I suppose he could get a call later in the year, but we're doomed at that point anyway (as though we aren't already doomed  ).