Ramon Urias 2024

[survivedc]

6 hours ago, Bemorewins said:

1983 = over 40 years ago under a totally different structure/era of baseball. 
 

Surely there have to be more recent, relevant examples?

 

Really every championship team will have a guy or two in the Urias/Mateo/Hays mold. The question is going to be how much playing time will they get as the season goes on. From a quick run through the last 6 or 7 WS groupings, it looks like 1 guy with a sub .700 OPS getting ~300PA and that's usually a catcher or utility guy. 

[CaptainRedbeard]

Kemp will be gone for Holliday at some point this year. 

Santander and O’Hearn will be gone making space for Kjerstad and Mayo after this year. They’ll also likely get time this year if/when there are injuries and/or when rosters expand.

The big question with Urias is - will Mayo be playing any 3B? If so, Urias is superfluous. If not, there’s still a utility role IF for him behind Gunnar/Holliday/Westburg if they also don’t trust Norby at 2B. That could be part of why they’ve still held onto Urias so far. 

That Urias roster spot could ultimately go to Norby or Stowers, or Basallo if they want 3 catchers…and Mateo is also not needed if Holliday is the backup SS.

I think the ultimate future of the last couple bench spots between Urias, Mateo, Stowers and Norby really depends on the defensive developments of Holliday, Mayo and Basallo, so it’s not too surprising that Elias has held onto all of those players while the very young top 3 prospects continue to develop on the defensive side of the ball.

[btdart20]

4 minutes ago, CaptainRedbeard said:

Kemp will be gone for Holliday at some point this year. 

Santander and O’Hearn will be gone making space for Kjerstad and Mayo after this year. They’ll also likely get time this year if/when there are injuries and/or when rosters expand.

The big question with Urias is - will Mayo be playing any 3B? If so, Urias is superfluous. If not, there’s still a utility role IF for him behind Gunnar/Holliday/Westburg if they also don’t trust Norby at 2B. That could be part of why they’ve still held onto Urias so far. 

That Urias roster spot could ultimately go to Norby or Stowers, or Basallo if they want 3 catchers…and Mateo is also not needed if Holliday is the backup SS.

I think the ultimate future of the last couple bench spots between Urias, Mateo, Stowers and Norby really depends on the defensive developments of Holliday, Mayo and Basallo, so it’s not too surprising that Elias has held onto all of those players while the very young top 3 prospects continue to develop on the defensive side of the ball.

Could this be the last ride for Santander, Hays, Urias, and Mateo (with Santander having an outside chance at a QO)?  

[Frobby]

On 4/4/2024 at 7:33 AM, gtman55 said:

Overall, even a blind person can see we have so many players at AAA who are upgrades to guys like Urias and Kemp. Time to do the right thing to make our MLB team better.

This is one area where Hyde and Elias confuse me. And if you're not planning on bringing up guys, trade them for quality pitching.

 

This isn't 2020 anymore. Our World Series window is open and our GM needs to act accordingly.

 

This is extremely simple.  It’s defense.  If you’ve been following the Tides this year, they’re tearing the cover off the ball but all of the top prospects there have struggled defensively.   And Elias and Hyde value defense a lot more than the average fan apparently does.  

[Mooreisbetter27]

8 minutes ago, Frobby said:

This is extremely simple.  It’s defense.  If you’ve been following the Tides this year, they’re tearing the cover off the ball but all of the top prospects there have struggled defensively.   And Elias and Hyde value defense a lot more than the average fan apparently does.  

In before Can asks why O'Hearn is playing outfield.

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, Mooreisbetter27 said:

In before Can asks why O'Hearn is playing outfield.

Darn!

[Can_of_corn]

So why is Mateo playing outfield?

[forphase1]

10 minutes ago, Frobby said:

This is extremely simple.  It’s defense.  If you’ve been following the Tides this year, they’re tearing the cover off the ball but all of the top prospects there have struggled defensively.   And Elias and Hyde value defense a lot more than the average fan apparently does.  

They certainly CLAIM to value defense more than the average fan.  Though I wonder if some of it is just to give cover to the decisions they make.  After all, some of the decisions they make at times certainly contradicts the idea that they place a HUGE value on defense.  

[Frobby]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

So why is Mateo playing outfield?

In Mateo’s case, I believe they think he can be above average out there with his speed and athleticism.   I’m sure they don’t think that about O’Hearn.  

Since this is a Urias thread, I want to mention that he hit very well this spring (.994 OPS), so it’s not like it was a hard decision to put him on the team given his past track record (which, I’ll remind everyone, is 7.5 rWAR in 334 games played, a Gold Glove at 3B and a career 104 OPS+).  He’s gotten off to a slow start, but it’s 13 PA, so let’s not pretend that has any significance.   He’ll be fine.  

[Frobby]

28 minutes ago, forphase1 said:

They certainly CLAIM to value defense more than the average fan.  Though I wonder if some of it is just to give cover to the decisions they make.  After all, some of the decisions they make at times certainly contradicts the idea that they place a HUGE value on defense.  

Last year they were 5th out of 30 teams in UZR, 6th in Rtot, 8th in Rdrs.   So while they do occasionally cut against the grain of optimizing the defense at times, I’d say the evidence is pretty strong that they value it highly.   

[Pickles]

10 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Last year they were 5th out of 30 teams in UZR, 6th in Rtot, 8th in Rdrs.   So while they do occasionally cut against the grain of optimizing the defense at times, I’d say the evidence is pretty strong that they value it highly.   

It's also extremely disingenuous to suggest that giving a sub-par defender an occasional start in RF at Camden Yards is the same thing as running a sub-par defender out there every night at 2b or 3b.

[forphase1]

2 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Last year they were 5th out of 30 teams in UZR, 6th in Rtot, 8th in Rdrs.   So while they do occasionally cut against the grain of optimizing the defense at times, I’d say the evidence is pretty strong that they value it highly.   

That only shows that we had a good defense.  Doesn't actually show just how much that value that internally.  I'm not saying that defense isn't a part of the equation.  It is and it should be.  But I do question if it's as important to management as they sometimes say or suggest in interviews/questions.  Too often they do some goofy stuff in regards to defense to make me think that it REALLY carries as much weight inside of the organization that they claim.

To put another way, I think sometimes they use defense as a cover to give cover to otherwise unpopular or questionable decisions, and that use of defense talking points has us overstating how much emphasis they really put on it.  For example, keeping Mateo around when he was terrible at the plate most of last year and sending Holliday/Mayo down.  In both cases defense was given as a large reason, but in both cases I believe that defense was just a small part of the real reason those decisions were made (they think they can still unlock last April Mateo and service time issues for Holliday/Mayo).  

As we have seen, sometimes the Os don't do the best when discussing things, and overstating the chances of something, be it the whole 'liftoff' comments or the Holliday making the OD roster talk.  I feel like defense is kinda in the same boat.  Not that it isn't important and not that it doesn't factor into decision making processes, but that it likely isn't as heavily weighed as it seems.  Otherwise some of the lineup/position decisions wouldn't be made.  Just my opinion of course.  

[forphase1]

Just now, Pickles said:

It's also extremely disingenuous to suggest that giving a sub-par defender an occasional start in RF at Camden Yards is the same thing as running a sub-par defender out there every night at 2b or 3b.

Oh, like Adam Frazier.....

[emmett16]

The first game against KC Urias barreled 2 balls to deep right center that would have been a HR in July.  If those balls go out, he’s tied for team lead in HR with a gaudy OPS and we aren’t having this conversation. 

[Pickles]

7 minutes ago, forphase1 said:

Oh, like Adam Frazier.....

The defensive stats on Frazier varied.  I felt his range was below average, but he made all the plays he got to, and turned a nice double play.

I'm not sure it's fair to say he was below average, nor is it fair to say they ran him out there everyday, particularly in the 2nd half.