Example A of why you fire Buck after 3 seasons.

[TouchemAll]

I'm not even sure his "loyalty" to JJ is a good thing for JJ, but I really wonder what the other 24 guys are thinking.

Agree Buck's not helping JJ or the rest of the team these guys are only human too it has to affect them some what right now. I don't think JJ is finished, but he needs another roll in the BP right now to work out of it.

They are sitting on his fastballs right now WITH BIG EYES

[foxfield]

Yeah, but this is how it starts.

Some people start making threads about it on here, saying they want Buck fired or starting a thread about who you'd like to see as manager other than Buck. Then it picks up steam, pretty soon Roch makes a post about how "I'm not hearing anything about Buck being fired, there's no evidence to suggest that." Which is probably enough to get people on the radio talking about how the fans are getting upset, then pretty soon a dumbass site like MLB trade rumors (who has actually done a good job of building a bit of credibility over the years) picks up on it and has an inflammatory headline like "Buck on the hot seat in Baltimore?" which is a hook that'll get everyone wondering about how much longer he'll last here. Then it goes national, there's a short article or two about it on espn.com, Buster Olney talks about it on his podcast, everyones saying that there's no way Buck is being fired yet PEOPLE ARE STILL TALKING ABOUT BUCK BEING FIRED SO SOMEONE MUST BE TALKING ABOUT BUCK BEING FIRED. Pretty soon it escalates to the point where DD has to make a statement about Buck's job being safe, in which people will take from it what they will. Pro Buck people will say STFU, it's not happening while anti-Buck people are like "Yeah right, let's see what happens in the offseason."

I'm firmly convinced this is how a poop-storm rises up about a managers job security in this day and age.

yeah, like this?

http://espn.go.com/blog/sweetspot/post/_/id/39115/jim-johnson-2013s-least-valuable-player?ex_cid=espnapi_public

[atomic]

If the Orioles signed Mark Reynolds he would probably be playing every day and batting close to zero. If Buck likes a player you will play everyday no matter what the results. If Buck doesn't like a player you have one bad outing and you are back to the minors.

[atomic]

Agree Buck's not helping JJ or the rest of the team these guys are only human too it has to affect them some what right now. I don't think JJ is finished, but he needs another roll in the BP right now to work out of it.

They are sitting on his fastballs right now WITH BIG EYES

JJ should have the role Kevin Gregg has last year.

[SeaBird]

Story I heard was that Buck told them that the current roster wasn't going to make it and a rebuild would be needed.

"Rebuild"? The "current" roster he had was loaded. He had three-time All-Star shortstop Michael Young, switch-hitting slugger and Gold Glove first baseman Mark Teixeira, two-time All-Star third baseman Hank Blalock, closer Akinori Otsuka and Kevin Millwood, the No. 1 starting pitcher with four years left on his contract. They also had nine potential free agents, including Carlos Lee, Gary Matthews Jr., Mark DeRosa, catcher Rod Barajas, and starting pitchers Vicente Padilla and Adam Eaton.

Of his firing, Showalter said, "You never heard me make an excuse all year, and I'm not going to start now. We just didn't get it done. They want to go in a new direction with a new voice. With the shelf life of managers, I feel fortunate."

Daniels acknowledged that he would be looking for a different kind of communicator, but played down what impact any players' discontentment with Showalter and the manager's hands-on approach had with the decision.

Sounds like they really wanted him gone if they were willing to eat $5M to send him packing.

[Can_of_corn]

"Rebuild"? The "current" roster he had was loaded. He had three-time All-Star shortstop Michael Young, switch-hitting slugger and Gold Glove first baseman Mark Teixeira, two-time All-Star third baseman Hank Blalock, closer Akinori Otsuka and Kevin Millwood, the No. 1 starting pitcher with four years left on his contract. They also had nine potential free agents, including Carlos Lee, Gary Matthews Jr., Mark DeRosa, catcher Rod Barajas, and starting pitchers Vicente Padilla and Adam Eaton.

Of his firing, Showalter said, "You never heard me make an excuse all year, and I'm not going to start now. We just didn't get it done. They want to go in a new direction with a new voice. With the shelf life of managers, I feel fortunate."

Daniels acknowledged that he would be looking for a different kind of communicator, but played down what impact any players' discontentment with Showalter and the manager's hands-on approach had with the decision.

Sounds like they really wanted him gone if they were willing to eat $5M to send him packing.

Buck was let go after the 2006 season and Tex was traded during the...wait for it....2007 season. The 2007 and 2008 teams both had worse records then Buck's 2006 squad.

Seems to me that he was right and the 2006 squad wasn't in a position to contend in 2007-2008.

They didn't start winning until they developed pitching.

[ledzepp8]

I think Buck has to replace JJ now. I think it was hard for him to do it before now because of the strong track record and then JJ seemingly rebounding until the past week. Now it had to be done because it's got to be in JJ's head by now.

[OrangeJerseys]

Probably the best post in the thread.

I'd also like to say that after one and a half good seasons of baseball, this board is semi reminiscent of Sox/Yanks fandom. Yup, I said it. Crying about a team that's 10 games over .500 and talking about firing the manager. That's the type of stuff we'd go laugh at on Sons of Sam Horn after taking 2 out of 3 from the Sox while they were fighting for their playoff lives in September while we're wondering if we'll get the 3rd or 4th pick.

It wasn't that long ago that we'd be thrilled to be in a position like this. A lot of people are starting to act entitled and spoiled, which is their perogative. I'm not judging or saying it's bad, I'm just simply saying what I'm seeing. It's incredibly interesting to me in seeing what it takes to make a fanbase turn on a player or manager who was once heralded in the not too distant past.

In this case, it ain't much from a fanbase who spent 14 years wallowing in misery.

Another great post.

[Uli2001]

I personally think that Showalter deserves credit for the Orioles' turnaround, but he gets way too much of it. The credit should go first to the players on the field, then to the front office, and then to the manager. There's a lot of talent on this team. It's not like he's milking rocks or something. This year, it can be argued the opposite, that he's in the way of team success, with his refusal to demote Johnson and shuffling the lineup when they struggle (Wieters hitting behind Davis, Jones must bat fourth, et al).

[25 Nuggets]

Yeah, but this is how it starts.

Some people start making threads about it on here, saying they want Buck fired or starting a thread about who you'd like to see as manager other than Buck. Then it picks up steam, pretty soon Roch makes a post about how "I'm not hearing anything about Buck being fired, there's no evidence to suggest that." Which is probably enough to get people on the radio talking about how the fans are getting upset, then pretty soon a dumbass site like MLB trade rumors (who has actually done a good job of building a bit of credibility over the years) picks up on it and has an inflammatory headline like "Buck on the hot seat in Baltimore?" which is a hook that'll get everyone wondering about how much longer he'll last here. Then it goes national, there's a short article or two about it on espn.com, Buster Olney talks about it on his podcast, everyones saying that there's no way Buck is being fired yet PEOPLE ARE STILL TALKING ABOUT BUCK BEING FIRED SO SOMEONE MUST BE TALKING ABOUT BUCK BEING FIRED. Pretty soon it escalates to the point where DD has to make a statement about Buck's job being safe, in which people will take from it what they will. Pro Buck people will say STFU, it's not happening while anti-Buck people are like "Yeah right, let's see what happens in the offseason."

I'm firmly convinced this is how a poop-storm rises up about a managers job security in this day and age.

You make too much sense Moose. Must spread rep, etc.

ENTERTAINMENT BUSINESS. ESPN (and now FOX sports, etc) has too much power but that's the business.

yeah, like this?

http://espn.go.com/blog/sweetspot/post/_/id/39115/jim-johnson-2013s-least-valuable-player?ex_cid=espnapi_public

This is a great thing for fans who want JJ gone! The topic is going national. Forces Buck to reply. Then we find out about the mindset of the team. But if Buck sticks with JJ for the rest of the season do we change the manager whose done 9 things right, for the sake of item #10? Let's at least get through the Colorado series.

[SeaBird]

Buck was let go after the 2006 season and Tex was traded during the...wait for it....2007 season. The 2007 and 2008 teams both had worse records then Buck's 2006 squad.

Seems to me that he was right and the 2006 squad wasn't in a position to contend in 2007-2008.

They didn't start winning until they developed pitching.

In retrospect, that may well be but I haven't seen anything that reported that Showalter told the Rangers FO that the team needed to rebuild.

Clearly, in his comments, Daniels had expected (pardon the pun) more bang for his buck in what he considered to be at least a good team on paper. Whether it fair or not, never getting the team higher than 3rd place during his tenure cost Showalter his job.

This article seems to indicate that perhaps some players weren't happy playing for him and that there was some discontent:

http://newbergreport.com/article.asp?articleid=309

[Going Underground]

So genius one year and bum the next. Can we please get Davey Johnson after he leaves the Nats.

Kevin Gregg has pebounded nicely this year. Hope for JJ but I think it might have to be on another team

[Redskins Rick]

Buck is 47th on the all-time manager list.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Major_League_Baseball_managers_by_wins

As of 11 August 2013 he was:

[TABLE=class: sortable wikitable jquery-tablesorter]

<tbody>[TR]

[TD]47[/TD]

[TH]Buck Showalter[/TH]

[TD]1,143[/TD]

[TD]1,070[/TD]

[TD].516[/TD]

[/TR]

</tbody>[/TABLE]

Pretty strong credentials for getting the job done.

[Crazysilver03]

So genius one year and bum the next. Can we please get Davey Johnson after he leaves the Nats.

Kevin Gregg has pebounded nicely this year. Hope for JJ but I think it might have to be on another team

His honeymoon period is over. He has been awful since the end of July. The Cubs waited too long to cash in.

[Bradysburns]

The team has the talent. And Bucks roster management will keep them out this year.

Maybe. But it got them IN last year. I would say the only problem is sticking with JJ too long.

The idea of firing Buck is, frankly, ridiculous. In Buck I trust.

He's done what he's done this year with a fairly mediocre starting pitching staff (not a single ace candidate)... no DH to speak of... terrible production out of 2nd base... etc.

I even love his pressers. But I guess that puts me in the minority.

I for one would love to see what Buck could do with some quality offseason acquisitions (kinda like Boston added this past year). And I think we're going to get the chance to see that.