Jackson Holliday 2024

[Sports Guy]

Just now, Gofannon said:

They are not going to make the big deal they made about his arrival, give out 15,000 t-shirts to fans with his picture on it, then send him down 9 days later because he looks completely lost.  It's just not going to happen.  Cowser and Stowers struggled last year and earned their demotion, but Holliday's the top-rated prospect in the game and is going to get more leeway before anything happens.

I do think they'll start platooning him until he heats up, and if we reach May and he's 2 for 50, I would be shocked if they kept him up.  There will also be a difference between struggles on the West Coast when no one is watching and struggles at home against the Yankees.  That is where the rubber would meet the road, I think.

 

Sure…Gunnar sat vs some lefties too.  I can see that. That’s fine.

[RZNJ]

2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think his confidence is fine.

I don't think most professional athletes lack for confidence.

You don’t think professional athletes confidence is affected when they are failing like never before?    

[RZNJ]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

It’s just a dumb and ignorant thing to say right now. Could that change with another awful week or 2?  Sure..right now it’s just another in the long line of awful arguments.

It’s dumb and ignorant to say his confidence is affected by his futility at the plate after 9 games but after 15 games, maybe?

You get to see dumb and ignorant every morning when you shave.

[Can_of_corn]

5 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

You don’t think professional athletes confidence is affected when they are failing like never before?    

Once again didn't say that.

You love misrepresenting my statements.

Do I think Jackson's confidence has taken a hit?  Sure.

He's probably slightly less confident than he was before.

I don't think his confidence level has dropped to a point where it is anything close to an issue.

I think most professional athletes are extremely confident individuals and are pretty resilient mentally.

I think it is "dumb and ignorant" to diagnose a player's mental state from behind a keyboard.

Edited April 22 by Can_of_corn

[InsideCoroner]

7 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Gunnar was a sub 200 hitter in late May last year and had a 6-37 stretch from late April to early May with 11 Ks.

Is that as bad?  No. Is it still awful?  Did he still look overmatched?  Yes he did.

I’m all for giving Holliday another 10-15 starts to turn things around. He hasn’t cost us any games yet, just a few runs in situational hitting, and the team has been winning.

But you can’t remotely compare him to Gunnar. Even at the end of last May with his struggles, Gunnar had a .330 OBP and an OPS of .700. That’s a world of difference from a .108 OPS.

I think Holliday will turn it around, but Gunnar was never that overmatched. 

 

[Moose Milligan]

14 minutes ago, baltfan said:

Who is saying give up on him?  People are saying at worst send him down for a bit to get his confidence back and revamp his swing a bit.  

He can revamp his swing and figure out his problems in Baltimore. 

[RZNJ]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

Once again didn't say that.

You love misrepresenting my statements.

Do I think Jackson's confidence has taken a hit?  Sure.

He's probably slightly less confident than he was before.

I don't think his confidence level has dropped to a point where it is anything close to an issue.

I think most professional athletes are extremely confident individuals and are pretty resilient mentally.

Slightly less confident.   That would mean his struggles have affected his confidence.    Do you think his struggles are more physical or mental?

[RZNJ]

1 minute ago, Moose Milligan said:

He can revamp his swing and figure out his problems in Baltimore. 

Revamping one’s swing at the ML level sounds like quite the undertaking.  None of the experts here or elsewhere had a problem with his swing before.   I’m sure he’ll figure it out sooner or later but is it fair to the team and is it fair to other players waiting for a chance?

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Slightly less confident.   That would mean his struggles have affected his confidence.    Do you think his struggles are more physical or mental?

I'm sure I'm not qualified to judge.

And yes, his confidence level has probably changed.  Heck someone loses five pounds and they feel more confident going to the beach.  Guy has on his favorite shirt maybe he feels more confident talking up that cute UPS lady.

[waroriole]

12 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

It’s dumb and ignorant to say his confidence is affected by his futility at the plate after 9 games but after 15 games, maybe?

You get to see dumb and ignorant every morning when you shave.

What kind of psycho shaves every morning?

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, waroriole said:

What kind of psycho shaves every morning?

 I use an electric razor, I don't need to look at a picture of RZNJ when I shave.

[Sports Guy]

1 minute ago, InsideCoroner said:

I’m all for giving Holliday another 10-15 starts to turn things around. He hasn’t cost us any games yet, just a few runs in situational hitting, and the team has been winning.

But you can’t remotely compare him to Gunnar. Even at the end of last May with his struggles, Gunnar had a .330 OBP and an OPS of .700. That’s a world of difference from a .108 OPS.

I think Holliday will turn it around, but Gunnar was never that overmatched. 

 

I can absolutely compare it and I just did.  First of all, yes Gunnar was better at sucking but Gunnar did have garbage 30-40 at bats stretches…as did Adley.

Holliday could switch things around in 15 at bats.  That’s the whole point here.

Every player can look awful for 30-40 at bat stretches. We see it every year.

This is the most advanced prospect we have had, especially at this age, in a decade. He is universally seen as one of the best overall #1 prospects in the last 10-15 years. 
 

So unless you believe Elias is full of sh!t, that the Os all of a sudden stopped figuring out how to develop guys and that every scout and analyst is wrong, I think the level of “worry” has gone completely overboard.  
 

Not that I’m surprised..that’s what fans do 

[Pickles]

24 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

1-30 is worse than 6-30 but both still suck.  So yes, there are levels to it but either way, the player is still sh!tty.

The thing is, talent is different. When you are a middling prospect, you worry about a 1-30. You doubt the guy and you say, maybe they need more seasoning.

But when that player is one of the top 10 prospects of the last decade and comes from a family lead by a high level ML player that he can bounce stuff off of, you worry a hell of a lot less.

I meant to say Holliday in my prior post BTW.

You can't just give a cursory node to bad isn't equal, but still bad' bad.

Those gradations of bad mean quite a lot in a case like this imo.

Cowser looked the worst out of all of them when he first came up, and he still was a significant level upon what Holliday has done so far.

Go look at the batted ball stats posted above.  They're awful.  They make Hays, who has been terrible this season, look like Babe Ruth.

Holliday is striking out over 50% of the time, and he's hit like one ball well in 30+ PAs.  Cowser was at least walking last season.

Now, I'm not sending him down yet- although he wouldn't be up yet either if I was in control.  But I said a few days ago I'd give him another 25-50 PAs before I sent him down, if he shows no improvement.

We're only like 8 Abs into that, but he hasn't shown any improvement either.

[Sports Guy]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

 I use an electric razor, I don't need to look at a picture of RZNJ when I shave.

Probably make you cut yourself if you did.

[baltfan]

1 minute ago, RZNJ said:

Does anyone think he isn’t doubting himself right now and that his confidence is down.   Of course, Elias isn’t going to say it and Holliday doesn’t want to admit it.    One more week of this and they’ll do what’s best for Holliday and the team.   

This is might thought. I am fine with giving him  a couple of more weeks but at some point he is more likely to help later with a reset vs staying it’s the team.