O's Interested In Tomas ? (Signs with Arizona)

[25 Nuggets]

I think the days of PA holding this franchise back are gone. DD and Buck are in charge.

I think John Angelos is in charge now. Which appears to be a good thing.

[waroriole]

Due diligence

[Aristotelian]

Puig has some red flags, not just out of the game, either. The guy had 4 HR's and 17 RBI's after the AS Break, he may well bust after all.

You seriously would take Markakis for Puig straight up? The guy had a rough second half but ended up with an OBP of .382, almost the same as last year. He may have been rushed to the big leagues and have some other issues but he has already been worth every penny of $40 million and still has five years left. His second half (.780 OPS) was still better than Markakis's "hot" first half (.746).

[MurphDogg]

You seriously would take Markakis for Puig straight up? The guy had a rough second half but ended up with an OBP of .382, almost the same as last year. He may have been rushed to the big leagues and have some other issues but he has already been worth every penny of $40 million and still has five years left. His second half (.780 OPS) was still better than Markakis's "hot" first half (.746).

I agree with you that Puig is superior but a couple of your facts are wrong. Puig has four years left on his contract not five and he retains the right to opt in to arbitration when he reached 3 years of service time so he will end up making much more than $40 million.

[Malike]

You seriously would take Markakis for Puig straight up? The guy had a rough second half but ended up with an OBP of .382, almost the same as last year. He may have been rushed to the big leagues and have some other issues but he has already been worth every penny of $40 million and still has five years left. His second half (.780 OPS) was still better than Markakis's "hot" first half (.746).

Nowhere did I say that I wouldn't take Puig for Markakis straight up, so I'm not sure why you are in such shock and awe that I would have the audacity to not make that deal. The discussion is about dropping tens/hundreds of millions of dollars on the Cuban upstarts, and someone is going to get burned badly. Puig has a lot of talent, but appears that he lacks desire, I mean, he's being benched all the time for doing stupid things. He may well be great, or he may well be mediocre for the rest of his contract.

[clapdiddy]

I would love to see us get involved with Tomas, but I don't think this franchise can take a chance on a long-term commitment like that. If we could somehow work out something in the 3-year range, I'd gladly consider it.

I agree with Malike in that one of these contracts is going to burn someone badly (like M. Gonzalez in Philly...thus far). I'm not sure I want that to be us.

[TouchemAll]

I agree. I'd take it a step further. The O's will never win a bidding war for one of these top Cuban players. It's not in their DNA.

This ^^^ :agree:

[Aristotelian]

Nowhere did I say that I wouldn't take Puig for Markakis straight up, so I'm not sure why you are in such shock and awe that I would have the audacity to not make that deal. The discussion is about dropping tens/hundreds of millions of dollars on the Cuban upstarts, and someone is going to get burned badly. Puig has a lot of talent, but appears that he lacks desire, I mean, he's being benched all the time for doing stupid things. He may well be great, or he may well be mediocre for the rest of his contract.

You started off saying Puig is not worth $100 million. I responded that his contract is $40 million, which happens to be in the range of the consensus market value for Markakis. You responded "Puig may well be a bust" even at that price. If you think he is not worth $40m, then you are saying he is not better than Markakis because that is how the market is pricing Markakis. I would say that even if Puig underachieves he is still going to be an excellent value and far from a bust, and if he fulfills his potential he will be a massive bargain.

I don't know anything about Tomas. Perhaps he is the guy that signs a fat contract and does nothing. At least recently, the Cuban players' stuff seems to translate well to MLB. We are never going to get a player like Puig or Abreu if we don't take a chance. I certainly wouldn't fault Dan for trying if he wants to go that route.

[Malike]

You started off saying Puig is not worth $100 million. I responded that his contract is $40 million, which happens to be in the range of the consensus market value for Markakis. You responded "Puig may well be a bust" even at that price. If you think he is not worth $40m, then you are saying he is not better than Markakis because that is how the market is pricing Markakis. I would say that even if Puig underachieves he is still going to be an excellent value and far from a bust, and if he fulfills his potential he will be a massive bargain.

I don't know anything about Tomas. Perhaps he is the guy that signs a fat contract and does nothing. At least recently, the Cuban players' stuff seems to translate well to MLB. We are never going to get a player like Puig or Abreu if we don't take a chance. I certainly wouldn't fault Dan for trying if he wants to go that route.

Yeah. I was talking about what Tomas is likely going to get. I'll stop here because your reading comprehension is going to keep causing confusion if we continue to discuss this. This is a thread about Tomas, I made a post about Puig possibly not being what he has the potential to be. Its been widely reported he's not very coachable, doesn't take well to veteran leadership, and likes to do his own thing. He may be his own worst enemy. That's just the on field stuff. Plenty of off field concerns as well. As Murph pointed out, he has an opt out and if he continues play to his potential he's going to cost several times what Markakis will.

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[brianod]

Have you seen Peter Angelos lately?

Even if Peter is not involved, do you see Buck and DD getting a large enough budget to compete for this guy over NY, Boston, LA and the Cubs? And if they do, it would probably mean Nick and Cruz are gone. Huge risk. This move, if made, will make or break DD's regime

[Can_of_corn]

Even if Peter is not involved, do you see Buck and DD getting a large enough budget to compete for this guy over NY, Boston, LA and the Cubs? And if they do, it would probably mean Nick and Cruz are gone. Huge risk. This move, if made, will make or break DD's regime

Not bringing back Nick and Cruz are nice ancillary benefits to signing Tomas.

[brianod]

No bringing back Nick and Cruz are nice ancillary benefits to signing Tomas.

lol, I'm with you on that but as long as we are going for it, lets get Miller too!

[weams]

Even if Peter is not involved, do you see Buck and DD getting a large enough budget to compete for this guy over NY, Boston, LA and the Cubs? And if they do, it would probably mean Nick and Cruz are gone. Huge risk. This move, if made, will make or break DD's regime

Yes. I believe they can have a budget to do this. You are just spending Wieters and Davis money a year early.

[brianod]

Yes. I believe they can have a budget to do this. You are just spending Wieters and Davis money a year early.

I guess I'm the only one not giving up on resigning Davis after a bounceback year?

[Can_of_corn]

I guess I'm the only one not giving up on resigning Davis after a bounceback year?

I'm not dismissing it out of hand.