Non-Pitching Spending

[Sports Guy]

25 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

I want to alert the staff of OH that Sports Guy's account has been hacked.  The real Sports Guy would never advocate for the O's not to sign a top FA SS.

I’m rarely on board with signing high dollar FA.

[Bemorewins]

11 hours ago, oriolediehard said:

The starting pitching staff next year projection is:

John Means.                              Tyler Wells.                                Grayson Rodriguez.                      DL Hall.                                        Dean Kremer.                              Bradish                                      Voth, Watkins. Lyles if resigned???                        Possible surprise Mike Bauman. 

Seems like a pretty good staff without spending for FA.

What do you all think?

Sorry if I misspelled any names.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Of all those names who are you betting your season on in a game 7 against Verlander, deGrom, Castillo, etc?

Means won’t be back until mid season because of the TJ and who knows when he will round into top form if at any time next year. The only other guy with that potential/pedigree is Grayson Rodriguez and I would hate to put that kind of pressure on him in year 1.

Like or not, if the O’s want to win a World Series that have to pay the price. 
 

We have tremendous talent, resources within the org. But I think it would be a shame to have all of the pieces in place to finally win a World Series and then be unwilling to add the one big piece you need. 
 

I HOPE that the org’s top priority next year and going forward is to win a World Series. Otherwise what was all the loosing for? We are most likely NEVER going to be in this position again with the number of assets and the timing of the cost of these players being this low. If we do that means that we will have to go through another 18- 21. And even then get VERY lucky. I am not interested in the org not doing what’s necessary to seize an opportunity like this. They don’t come around that often. It’s been almost 40 years since we’ve we won a pennant and we’ve only been realistically in the conversation 2 times in those 40 years.

We as long suffering fans deserve to have our patience and loyalty rewarded by a organization who is not “trying to win” by maintaining the lowest payroll in baseball. Having an 80, 90, 100 million dollar payroll is not going to kill ownership by any means. And if that’s what it takes to get to an ALCS, World Series, or even being champions next year, that’s why I HOPE the org will do. 

[RZNJ]

I've been through thick and thin.   The Orioles were basically a winning organization from the early 60's through the mid 80's.   They were noted as a model organization who played great defense (the Orioles way) and developed young players.

If the Orioles give me a team that is likely to be over .500 and in the hunt for a playoff spot, year in and year out, with young players coming in each year, and a thriving farm system with more on the way, that's about as much as I need to make me enjoy being an Orioles fan.   I know we may need a TOR to enhance our chances but, personally, I don't need it.    If GrayRod or Hall or Bradish or whoever turn into a TOR that is so much more enjoyable for me.    I'm not against getting a TOR starter but it's not imperative for me.   This team is much more enjoyable for me than the big money teams from 96-97 with Alomar.

[Just Regular]

I don't think Voth or Watkins have earned going to spring training with rotation jobs yet, but Kremer is getting there.

For today, I'm generally content with Grayson, Bradish, T. Wells and Kremer starting four of the first five games next season and at that point if you believe rotation balance a thing but Hall is too scattershot, maybe Sean Manaea around the Jon Gray price point is a fit if nothing truly spectacular happens.

I certainly hope Verlander opts out and sees BAL as a healthy place for him to be.     He's great enough to transcend any ordinary pitcher wish for a little LH balance in the rotation.    Everyone including him and his agent knows he's one of the world's best pitchers, and pitchers as great as him break more than they age.     The hamstring pitstop may freshen the arm for October.

[Just Regular]

11 minutes ago, Bemorewins said:

The only other guy with that potential/pedigree is Grayson Rodriguez and I would hate to put that kind of pressure on him in year 1.

I would LOVE to put that kind of pressure on him in Month 1

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, RZNJ said:

A starting pitcher is the most likely spot to upgrade.  As well as guys have pitched and even with Means coming back next year, a TOR starter who can also eat innings still makes the most sense.   I just don't believe they will spend 30M-35M to get that guy.    Elias said they would be aggressive in FA so I do expect them to do something and a veteran starter is the most likely spot.

Not a ton of supply in this FA class.  We could be paying a lot for not much of an upgrade.   Since this thread is called “non-pitching spending” I won’t get into detail here.  
 

[RZNJ]

13 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Not a ton of supply in this FA class.  We could be paying a lot for not much of an upgrade.   Since this thread is called “non-pitching spending” I won’t get into detail here.  
 

Ok.  I do not expect a big FA spending on a position player.  I would be very surprised.

[Sports Guy]

Clevinger, Lopez, GRod, Bradish/Hall/Voth/Kremer/Wells battling for 2 spots.

But I think we have to bring in 2 new starters, not just 1.  I would feel better with 1 if I had more confidence in Hall but it’s hard to have that right now.  
 

To me, the 2 biggest question marks entering the offseason(in terms of players) are Mateo and T Wells.

How they feel about those guys, if they want to rely on them, what position they are in, etc..are big keys with how you go about your offseason.

[Sports Guy]

15 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Not a ton of supply in this FA class.  We could be paying a lot for not much of an upgrade.   Since this thread is called “non-pitching spending” I won’t get into detail here.  
 

Yep..this is why I wanted them to spend in previous years.  Everyone wants to wait until “we are ready” but when you ar ready, you may not have the pieces available to add to your core.  
 

The trade market is easily the teams best way to attack augmenting the team.

[RZNJ]

16 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Yep..this is why I wanted them to spend in previous years.  Everyone wants to wait until “we are ready” but when you ar ready, you may not have the pieces available to add to your core.  
 

The trade market is easily the teams best way to attack augmenting the team.

With all due respect, and I'm not trying to troll you or start something.   If we had spent previously, we may not have discovered some pieces like Mateo, Kremer, Wells, and Voth.    You're also assuming that any pieces we would have bought would have performed and we wouldn't be locked into some undesirable contract.   In my opinion, because we did things this way, we couldn't be in a much better spot than we are right now.

Is Mateo a future piece.  I'm skeptical at this point.   He's proven he's a ML starting SS, IMO.   I'm just not sure he makes sense as our starting SS next year and moving forward.   Either way, he has more value than when we got him.   The problem with FA players is that if they don't peform and you almost feel like you have to play them because of the contract.    Look at the Kikuchi on the Blue Jays.   If they don't make the playoffs you could point to them continuing to start him despite being lousy.   But they did it because they were invested in him.  

[Sports Guy]

56 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

With all due respect, and I'm not trying to troll you or start something.   If we had spent previously, we may not have discovered some pieces like Mateo, Kremer, Wells, and Voth.    You're also assuming that any pieces we would have bought would have performed and we wouldn't be locked into some undesirable contract.   In my opinion, because we did things this way, we couldn't be in a much better spot than we are right now.

Is Mateo a future piece.  I'm skeptical at this point.   He's proven he's a ML starting SS, IMO.   I'm just not sure he makes sense as our starting SS next year and moving forward.   Either way, he has more value than when we got him.   The problem with FA players is that if they don't peform and you almost feel like you have to play them because of the contract.    Look at the Kikuchi on the Blue Jays.   If they don't make the playoffs you could point to them continuing to start him despite being lousy.   But they did it because they were invested in him.  

Sure, we may not have found pieces.  That’s true.  But so what?  I mean, do you want to rely on every offseason to turn around reclamation projects and ignore good players who are more of a sure thing?

I mean, that can be fine when you suck but when you don’t suck, that’s not what I want to rely on.

The 2013 and 2015 Os did a crap job of capitalizing on the success of the team and didn’t supplement it right enough.

[RZNJ]

Just now, Sports Guy said:

Sure, we may not have found pieces.  That’s true.  But so what?  I mean, do you want to rely on every offseason to turn around reclamation projects and ignore good players who are more of a sure thing?

I mean, that can be fine when you suck but when you don’t suck, that’s not what I want to rely on.

The 2013 and 2015 Os did a crap job of capitalizing on the success of the team and didn’t supplement it right enough.

 

No, I want to rely on it when we suck, just like we did.  Now we are at a point when we are less likely to be looking to plug holes like that or find players like that.   Now, we're at a point where we have replacements ready in the farm system.    Now, we have tons of payroll flexibility and depth do either sign a FA or make a trade for a quality player.   We also have a much better idea of what we need now.

[Sports Guy]

54 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

 

No, I want to rely on it when we suck, just like we did.  Now we are at a point when we are less likely to be looking to plug holes like that or find players like that.   Now, we're at a point where we have replacements ready in the farm system.    Now, we have tons of payroll flexibility and depth do either sign a FA or make a trade for a quality player.   We also have a much better idea of what we need now.

I don’t think we have a much better idea of what we need unless you are ok with relying on guys who have had failed pro careers and are doing well this year.

Not to mention, they have been very lucky with health this year.  In a different year, if we have health issues and more normalized play from players who aren’t that great, having the better depth and talent would be better.

As far as previous years…I will always take the one or 2 signings that can be great long term and help the team win.

You don’t need to get a lot of those guys but the occasional one is fine, even if you aren’t good…because you should be good soon enough.

I have been on the contend one 2023 wagon for a while now, so I’m good with that idea. In 2019 or 2020?  No you don’t do that.

[Bahama O's Fan]

For me, it's backup catcher and one big hitter, regardless of position. We can shuffle everyone else around

[RZNJ]

4 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I don’t think we have a much better idea of what we need unless you are ok with relying on guys who have had failed pro careers and are doing well this year.

Not to mention, they have been very lucky with health this year.  In a different year, if we have health issues and more normalized play from players who aren’t that great, having the better depth and talent would be better.

As far as previous years…I will always take the one or 2 signings that can be great long term and help the team win.

You don’t need to get a lot of those guys but the occasional one is fine, even if you aren’t good…because you should be good soon enough.

I have been on the contend one 2023 wagon for a while now, so I’m good with that idea. In 2019 or 2020?  No you don’t do that.

1. Who are the players with failed careers so far that we are relying on?   Mateo, who had 200 career AB's before we got him?  Voth?

2. One or two signings that can be great long term?   Sounds so easy.   Very few turn out that way.