Rosenthal: Orioles Join Holliday Bidding

[Orioles West]

I'd stick with 6/$108 and go no higher.

Really Holliday would be a luxury rather than a striking need. The power bat, though, would be great to have, but the O's have those developing.

I think he would do 6/108 if it is a team he likes. He has said the biggest contract isn't as important as playing somewhere he wants to play. He has repeated enough over the last six years, I am starting to believe him.

That aside, I think it would go a long way toward speeding up the rebuilding process.

-Don

[Mooreisbetter27]

See, I was trying to be a regular poster tonight and not start any crap. <b>I was just saying that I consider AGon something like David Ortiz, but I guess I could accept Reimold at DH. </b>

But this is all speculation at this point. No reason to be jerky tonight.

MSK

p.s. Moose, this isn't aimed at you, two other people decided to be snarky.

Then you have really weird considerations.

And if you're saying I was snarky... well... that's a little strange to me. My post wasn't snarky at all.

Nonetheless, I'm gonna have to just take a step back. I'm not gonna get all excited like I did with the Tex fiasco. That killed me. So I'll hope for the best and expect the worst.

[bluedog]

Well if we don't get rid of Reimold, and we get Holliday, what other option is there?

MSK

LF - Holliday

CF - Jones or Pie

RF - Markakis

DH - Reimold

1B - AGon

Trade Scott and one of Pie or Jones.

Seems reasonable to me. Gives the O's a fearsome offensive lineup and great defense all around.

[Moose Milligan]

See, I was trying to be a regular poster tonight and not start any crap. I was just saying that I consider AGon something like David Ortiz, but I guess I could accept Reimold at DH.

But this is all speculation at this point. No reason to be jerky tonight.

MSK

p.s. Moose, this isn't aimed at you, two other people decided to be snarky.

So let me get this straight...

You're one of the giant advocates of the spend now, spend big bucks crowd and Gonzalez is one of the guys you'd love to target in a trade...and you don't know that he's won two Gold Gloves and regarded as a great defender? Why would you consider him something like David Ortiz? Defensively they're not in the same realm.

I was simply trying to understand why you'd take his glove out of the field.

[bluedog]

See, I was trying to be a regular poster tonight and not start any crap. I was just saying that I consider AGon something like David Ortiz, but I guess I could accept Reimold at DH.

But this is all speculation at this point. No reason to be jerky tonight.

MSK

p.s. Moose, this isn't aimed at you, two other people decided to be snarky.

No one was snarky. They were simply confused about why we'd trade for a gold glove first baseman and then not play him at first base.

In fact I think people were being very polite to avoid trashing you for not knowing that AGon is a gold glove 1b. It's okay - we all make mistakes, but I don't think anyone was being mean to you about it.

[El Gordo]

I don't know. Adding Holliday doesn't really make this team a contender with a huge hole at first base and it creates a massive logjam in the outfield (Jones, Markakis, Pie, Reimold, Scott, Holliday - six guys for 3 positions).

So a trade must be in the works if Holliday signs. Since we have Atkins now at 3rd and our rotation is currently set, first base seems like the only target unless we're looking to get more prospects. Prospects don't make much sense if we're adding Holliday, Atkins, Millwood & Gonzalez in an attempt to compete now.

The fact we've been tied to other veteran pitchers suggests that we may be looking to move one of our projected starters - Guthrie, Matusz, Bergesen or Tillman.

It all points to a big trade involving one major league starter and one or two major league outfielders for a first baseman.

Why not AGon?[/QUOTE]Because 2 years of AGonz is not worth giving up Jones and Madusz. It's not worth Madusz.

[JTrea81]

If AM signs Holliday and trades for AGon are you writing a full retraction of all the bad things you've ever said about him?

My faith will have been restored...

[bluedog]

I don't know. Adding Holliday doesn't really make this team a contender with a huge hole at first base and it creates a massive logjam in the outfield (Jones, Markakis, Pie, Reimold, Scott, Holliday - six guys for 3 positions).

So a trade must be in the works if Holliday signs. Since we have Atkins now at 3rd and our rotation is currently set, first base seems like the only target unless we're looking to get more prospects. Prospects don't make much sense if we're adding Holliday, Atkins, Millwood & Gonzalez in an attempt to compete now.

The fact we've been tied to other veteran pitchers suggests that we may be looking to move one of our projected starters - Guthrie, Matusz, Bergesen or Tillman.

It all points to a big trade involving one major league starter and one or two major league outfielders for a first baseman.

Why not AGon?[/QUOTE]Because 2 years of AGonz is not worth giving up Jones and Madusz. It's not worth Madusz.

No one is suggesting that Matusz would be part of a deal. I think just about everyone on OH agrees that Matusz is untouchable.

And many people have agreed that any AGon deal must include an extension ala Halladay. Otherwise its not worth trading 1 - 2 of our top young players.

Assuming the O's can get an extension from AGon and that they sign Holliday, are you saying that there is still no circumstance under which you'd trade for AGon?

[bluedog]

My faith will have been restored...

so say we all.

[jdmyprez]

I am not sure what to think about all of this. Of course signing Holliday gives us a big name star with a big reputation but that is one heck of a lot of money to put out when we might be able to get the same production out of what we have now. Outfield positions are not our weakness at this point so I just don't understand the real interest. I think we could put together what it takes to get AGon without having to include any of our outfielders in the deal.

[Moose Milligan]

I still don't understand why some of you think if we get Holliday that automatically makes us runners for Gonzalez.

Can we expand the payroll by THAT much in an offseason? Keep in mind we don't have a B or NY on our hats.

[Orioles_Magic]

I still don't understand why some of you think if we get Holliday that automatically makes us runners for Gonzalez.

Can we expand the payroll by THAT much in an offseason? Keep in mind we don't have a B or NY on our hats.

Gonzalez wouldn't cost big bucks until 2012, unless we rip up his current contract.

He's signed for $4.75 million next year and $5.5 million in 2011.

If he plays out those two years before starting on the extension he gets, then we won't have to worry about it until then.

By then, hopefully we're winning enough and drawing enough attendance that we can support a larger payroll.

If not, we'd probably have to pull a Detroit and start trading away high-salaried players for prospects.

[El Gordo]

No one is suggesting that Matusz would be part of a deal. I think just about everyone on OH agrees that Matusz is untouchable.

And many people have agreed that any AGon deal must include an extension ala Halladay. Otherwise its not worth trading 1 - 2 of our top young players.

Assuming the O's can get an extension from AGon and that they sign Holliday, are you saying that there is still no circumstance under which you'd trade for AGon?

El Sid is. He is saying he has heard that the Pads are asking Jones and Madusz +. Regardless No batch of prospects should be given up for 2 years of AGonz. You are smokng something good if you think we are getting an extension. :rolleyestf:

[Arthur_Bryant]

Can we expand the payroll by THAT much in an offseason? Keep in mind we don't have a B or NY on our hats.

The Mike Gonzalez signing brings the 2010 payroll to $48MM, with Scott, Guthrie, Albers and Meredith to be negotiated. But I think that Scott would have to go, just for roster reasons, so you're probably around $54MM.

Figure $38-$40 MM between Holliday and a Gonzalez extension.

It works for 2010 and 2011. Even for 2012, Guthrie is the only significant player hitting his third arb year, and I would guess or hope that he'd be long gone by then (replaced by younger and better).

AM has really done an amazing job of clearing the decks.

[Moose Milligan]

El Sid is. He is saying he has heard that the Pads are asking Jones and Madusz +. Regardless No batch of prospects should be given up for 2 years of AGonz. You are smokng something good if you think we are getting an extension. :rolleyestf:

If El Sid is right about that, the Pads can go look elsewhere. I might not mind parting with Jones as the centerpiece for a Gonzalez deal but if they want Matusz MacPhail should laugh and hang up the phone. Both of them together is straight up laughable.

SG said it earlier and I agree...wouldn't even deal Matusz straight up for Gonzalez.