Orioles Pitching without Wieters

[webbrick2010]

So I admit I haven't done the research yet but it sure seems that the O's pitching has improved with the loss of Wieters.

I have felt for the last several years that Wieters inability to set a low target and his all around poor pitch framing have hurt the staff.

At this point whatever the before/after Wieters stats are they are a SSS....

but Joseph especially seems very good at setting a very quiet very low target and is excellent at framing the pitches

[BarclaySouthway]

At the risk of piling on, I agree. It's noticable with both catchers.

[sportsfan8703]

You're going to berated for this but I think this theory has legs.

[Guest]

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/pitching/split/41

Month of May we have the 4th best pitching in MLB.

[sportsfan8703]

At the very least, it should destroy the myth about how good some think Wieters is at calling a game and "handling" the staff.

Eh the Yanks will still pay em

[jabba72]

Has the rotation ever looked this good with Wieters? Its like night and day.

[Loophole]

At the very least, it should destroy the myth about how good some think Wieters is at calling a game and "handling" the staff.

No, it shouldn't. A week and a half of data is not enough to declare anything.

[Riggodrill44]

Or, just maybe, the pitchers are just now starting to really get into the rhythm of the season. There's been far fewer off days and rainouts since the end of April/early May. Not to say it isn't possible, but I severely doubt that the pitch framing and game calling difference from Wieters to Joseph/Clevenger is that great, in either direction, to warrant the improvement we've seen so far.

[24fps]

No, it shouldn't. A week and a half of data is not enough to declare anything.

I agree. Right now this is silly. Unfortunately it's beginning to look like Wieters might be out long enough to get a better idea.

[Guest]

Playing the Royals and Houston helps.

[Loophole]

People keep bringing up framing, and Wieters is apparently pretty bad at it but the rudimentary numbers since he's been on the DL don't support that. I'm not sure where to look beyond the comparison between Pf/x Zone% and BIS Zone% (Pf/x's uses its raw data to determine balls and strikes, BIS tracks ump calls, so if a catcher is good at framing the BIS % would be higher than the Pf/x %). I'm not going to figure out how to copy all the data cause it's already midnight, but you can look yourself by going to each pitcher's FG page --> Game logs --> "Plate Discipline" tab and then the "Plate Discipline" tab under the "PITCHf/x" tab.

Just looking at the small amount of data (and not including the past two starts because the BIS data isn't in yet) there doesn't seem to be anything suggesting the backups have been better. Chen's been unlucky in his two starts since Matt hit the DL, where his season numbers swing the other way (3.5% more called strikes than actual strikes). Ubaldo's been unlucky all year, but it hasn't gotten any better in his last two. In the two starts before his last one, Tillman had one lucky game and one atrociously unlucky game (56.6% strikes, 41.4% of them actually called) with Clevenger behind the plate. Bud's had two unlucky starts before tonight's game, including one with a 12% difference. And while Bud and Chris both pitched excellent games these past two nights, they didn't rack up a lot of strikeouts so I doubt the framing played a notable role. Lastly, Gonzo's also had two unluckily-framed starts since Matt stopped catching.

Of course this is all SSS and all of them except Chen have had less strikes called than they should all season -- not denying that Matt is a bad framer -- but it doesn't look like Clev/Caleb's framing has been a factor in the pitching success since he hit the DL.

[Loophole]

Okay. Let's revisit this in 3 years when all of the data is in.

Oh gosh, I'm sorry, I forgot to carpe diem. Let's all overstate 12 games worth of data for tomorrow we may die. Data takes too long to have significance so let's throw out the very idea of SSS.

[Il BuonO]

I don't know what all the fuss is about, I've never thought calling a game is one of Matt's strong suits.

[TonySoprano]

Latin, 8 emoticons, and drama queen all in one post. Pretty impressive.

I'm not as impressed with people making definitive declarations ("should") after 12 games. As the OP states, it's a small sample size. You chose to be rude and condescending talking about three years instead. I expect better out of you than that.

[Loophole]

Latin, 8 emoticons, and drama queen all in one post. Pretty impressive.

12 games nearly about as small a sample as you can get, so you responding with that post is essentially -- as I said -- you throwing out the very idea of SSS. I felt it deserved a worthy response. I guess 2 emoticons is too much data for one post.