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Cease vs everyone else

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Tony-OH Hangout Grand Counsel

Tony-OH

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4 hours ago, Pickles said:

My bigger point is that not only were the WS deranged even mentioning the names Basallo and Mayo, they were equally deluded about Cowser and Kjerstad.  Now, noone here was ever going to move Basallo or Mayo, but almost everyone was willing to give a least Cowser AND Ortiz, and MORE!, for Cease.  It was always an aburd overpay, and I'm glad that Elias has more discipline than the majority of this board.

You do know the Orioles would get two years of Cease though, right? 

I doubt Mayo or Basallo were ever in consideration by Elias, but I would have sent Kjerstad or Cowser as the headliner for two years of Cease. I know Cease is coming off a down year a bit, but he's a great bounce back candidate. 

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Tony-OH
Tony-OH

I'm just catching up on this but we know how Elias and company share information outside of their inner circle. They don't. We've heard from players many times say they don't hear from the Orioles abo

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Spy Fox
Spy Fox

@Sports Guyis so prolific, he's the #3 poster on the Soxtalk thread despite joining on page 102 of 149. He's also the #1 poster in this thread, so potentially on track to be the #1 poster on both team

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Roll Tide Hangout Grand Counsel

Roll Tide

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1 minute ago, Tony-OH said:

You do know the Orioles would get two years of Cease though, right? 

I doubt Mayo or Basallo were ever in consideration by Elias, but I would have sent Kjerstad or Cowser as the headliner for two years of Cease. I know Cease is coming off a down year a bit, but he's a great bounce back candidate. 

Me too … but I just don’t think it’s happening. My guess is they look for a reliever to replace Hall.

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Tony-OH Hangout Grand Counsel

Tony-OH

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1 hour ago, RZNJ said:

Technically, Hall is not a prospect but that doesn’t mean he couldn’t be the headliner.  Baseball America, who still treated Hall as a prospect, had him rated #76 and Ortiz outside the top 100.   I don’t agree with that but they are close enough in value, in my book, that I would call them 1A and 1B in this trade and it’s hard to say which one is which.

Even if you don't believe in Hall as a starter (I think everyone knows where I stand on this) he still has the upside of being a lights out closer. 

So let's call Hall and closer and Ortiz and average major league shortstop. That's pretty much 1A and 1B and a pretty good get for one year of any pitcher. And I'm not even counting the lottery ticket with the 34th pick. 

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Frobby Hangout Grand Counsel

Frobby

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4 hours ago, Pickles said:

It might be an open question as to who Mil values more- I still think Ortiz- but there's no doubt Ortiz was the headlining prospect.

Then perhaps you’ll explain why the Brewers’ press release lists Hall first and discusses him first.  
https://www.mlb.com/press-release/press-release-corbin-burnes-traded-to-baltimore#:~:text=Send Right-Handed Pitcher Corbin Burnes to the Orioles&text=MILWAUKEE - The Milwaukee Brewers have,right-handed pitcher Corbin Burnes.

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interloper Hangout Grand Counsel

interloper

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In his recent comments, Mike said they would be "opportunistic" but that they're "no longer on a mission" with regards to starting pitching. 

Elias shoots pretty straight if you know how to read between his lines. So to me it seems like the rotation is set unless something really just falls in their lap. 

He echoed similar things about the bullpen but in less certain terms IMO. I think they are still looking for a bullpen piece. 

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Moose Milligan Hangout Grand Counsel

Moose Milligan

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10 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Then perhaps you’ll explain why the Brewers’ press release lists Hall first and discusses him first.  
https://www.mlb.com/press-release/press-release-corbin-burnes-traded-to-baltimore#:~:text=Send Right-Handed Pitcher Corbin Burnes to the Orioles&text=MILWAUKEE - The Milwaukee Brewers have,right-handed pitcher Corbin Burnes.

Yeah I think the “headliner” for the Brewers depend on who you ask. One of the Athletic writers said it was Hall, too. 

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sportsfan8703 Hangout Grand Counsel

sportsfan8703

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16 minutes ago, interloper said:

In his recent comments, Mike said they would be "opportunistic" but that they're "no longer on a mission" with regards to starting pitching. 

Elias shoots pretty straight if you know how to read between his lines. So to me it seems like the rotation is set unless something really just falls in their lap. 

He echoed similar things about the bullpen but in less certain terms IMO. I think they are still looking for a bullpen piece. 

We’ve seen Dean Kremer in the playoffs. We should be very much still in on Cease. And I’m and huge Dean Kremer fan, but we’re trying to win a WS, not just make the playoffs and see what happens. We have available SP to add to the package that we didn’t have the luxury of trading before. I’m not asking for one of Snell/Montgomery. Cease is still attainable and would be a WS move. 

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deward Major Leaguer Rising Star

deward

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4 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

We’ve seen Dean Kremer in the playoffs. We should be very much still in on Cease. And I’m and huge Dean Kremer fan, but we’re trying to win a WS, not just make the playoffs and see what happens. We have available SP to add to the package that we didn’t have the luxury of trading before. I’m not asking for one of Snell/Montgomery. Cease is still attainable and would be a WS move. 

Did you happen to catch Cease in his only playoff start in 2021?

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interloper Hangout Grand Counsel

interloper

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3 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

We’ve seen Dean Kremer in the playoffs. We should be very much still in on Cease. And I’m and huge Dean Kremer fan, but we’re trying to win a WS, not just make the playoffs and see what happens. We have available SP to add to the package that we didn’t have the luxury of trading before. I’m not asking for one of Snell/Montgomery. Cease is still attainable and would be a WS move. 

Well, we only saw Kremer because Means got hurt basically. 

I would be fine rolling up to the playoffs with our top 4 right now. I wouldn't be opposed to Cease, I just don't think it's in the cards at this point between Elias taking his foot off the pedal and Getz being in outer space somewhere. 

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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42 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Then perhaps you’ll explain why the Brewers’ press release lists Hall first and discusses him first.  
https://www.mlb.com/press-release/press-release-corbin-burnes-traded-to-baltimore#:~:text=Send Right-Handed Pitcher Corbin Burnes to the Orioles&text=MILWAUKEE - The Milwaukee Brewers have,right-handed pitcher Corbin Burnes.

To be fair to Salty Cucumber, the way Elias answered one of the questions, it sounds like Ortiz was the key but it’s tough to say how much you can take into that.

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Malike Hangout Grand Counsel

Malike

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3 minutes ago, Spy Fox said:

Burnes lost his playoff start last season. Send him back! 

Come on, 1 game sample sizes should never be discounted. All the data you'll ever need about Kremer in the playoffs should come from his start in 2023.

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sportsfan8703 Hangout Grand Counsel

sportsfan8703

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2 minutes ago, Malike said:

Come on, 1 game sample sizes should never be discounted. All the data you'll ever need about Kremer in the playoffs should come from his start in 2023.

I like Kremer. He’s a bulldog. That was great for the previous iterations of the O’s. Now we need to shoot for some ceiling. Sell high. Buy low.

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